It is currently Sun Dec 01, 2024 2:16 am

All times are UTC - 6 hours [ DST ]




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 18 posts ] 
Author Message
PostPosted: Sun Aug 04, 2019 8:55 am 
Offline
Member
User avatar

Joined: Nov 25, 2015
Posts: 1431
Preferred Pronoun Set: Xhir/xhim, depending on Moon phase
I use two ways, one fancy and one effective

The fancy one is using some flavour of Karn the Creator "Tron" and then tutoring from the sideboard a couple of Amulets of Safekeeping, which actually deactivates all the zombies...then the game turns into a minigame of "me trying to survive while your Teferi starts bouncing my Amulets and I recast them and sweep your board and/or take care of your Krasis in the meantime"

According to our Lord Karsten, with 2 copies of Karn in the deck, you have a 31% chance of getting one of them by t4, and then having both Amulets in play in t5...39% by t7/t8...hence the "fanciness" it's not what I'd call a reliable tactic...but that makes it even more awesome when you manage to pull the trick

With 3 Karns, 43% and 52% respectively...and with 4, 53% and 63%

I have tried a lot of different "tron" builds, and I like the most Boros...yes, I know that Green is faster and probably better, but there's a number of Nissas I can play before getting the twitches...

:blush:

I play this:

Image

Again, more funny than optimized, as usual in my builds...I like to do silly things like Binding/Prison my own PWs before a Planar Cleansing, Helming my animated-by-Sharkan Dragon Ugins for max style points, getting the Chromatic for uberpowerful Golos, Overseer+Manifold the fak out of my Shaeeli tokens when they are a lot...etc etc


Like this post
Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Aug 04, 2019 9:00 am 
Offline
Member

Joined: Oct 13, 2016
Posts: 1832
Karsten wrote an article just recently on sideboard cards against Scapeshift: https://www.channelfireball.com/article ... -standard/

Ashiok
Alpine Moon
Blood Sun
Flame Sweep
Legion's End
Deputy of Detention
Unmoored Ego
Crafty Cutpurse

He didn't mention Amulet of Safekeeping though. Interesting idea, it seems a bit dorky (you still die if they make 20 zombies ...) but interesting nonetheless since you can pre-emptively play it and it'll be useful.


Like this post
Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Aug 04, 2019 9:01 am 
Offline
Member
User avatar

Joined: Nov 25, 2015
Posts: 1431
Preferred Pronoun Set: Xhir/xhim, depending on Moon phase
The effective one is playing Bant Ramp, which usually can go over Scapeshift...I use Finale of Glory instead of Mass Manipulation as finisher, found it incredible powerful with lil Teferi back up...(in fact, I hate so much the Manipulation/Melodies that I play Trostani main deck an all)

I play this:

Image

I have found that going high in Elementals is usually more effective as Ramp than using more mana dorks or Leylines of Abundance...it usually ramps so hard that you don't even need the Finales half of the time...I mean:

Image

That cap is from my last game...that's turn 7 :takei: and OP is Scapeshifting for the first time...enough said...notice the just 12 cards in my library...again, t7


Last edited by callmemaggit on Sun Aug 04, 2019 9:13 am, edited 2 times in total.

Like this post
Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Aug 04, 2019 9:04 am 
Offline
Member
User avatar

Joined: Nov 25, 2015
Posts: 1431
Preferred Pronoun Set: Xhir/xhim, depending on Moon phase
Banedon wrote:
Karsten wrote an article just recently on sideboard cards against Scapeshift: https://www.channelfireball.com/article ... -standard/

Ashiok
Alpine Moon
Blood Sun
Flame Sweep
Legion's End
Deputy of Detention
Unmoored Ego
Crafty Cutpurse

He didn't mention Amulet of Safekeeping though. Interesting idea, it seems a bit dorky (you still die if they make 20 zombies ...) but interesting nonetheless since you can pre-emptively play it and it'll be useful.


Yeah, I saw that...the Suns, Moons, Deputies, sweepers etc have the problem of Teferi...Cutpurse is just bad and clunky...Ashiok is more interesting, and Ego is getting more and more play, I tend to have those in my Espers, sure

TWO Amulets make all zombies hilariously 0/2, hence my sideboard and rant


Like this post
Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Aug 04, 2019 7:17 pm 
Offline
Member
User avatar

Joined: Apr 24, 2017
Posts: 5102
Location: Cucho Lambreta#13992
Best way to deal with the tokens ATM is Deputy of Detention in the Esper shell, you can bounce him with Teferi, rinse and repeat.

_________________
NGA HISTORIC LEAGUE
MANA CLINIC
:planeswalker:


Like this post
Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Aug 05, 2019 1:48 am 
Offline
Member
User avatar

Joined: Nov 25, 2015
Posts: 1431
Preferred Pronoun Set: Xhir/xhim, depending on Moon phase
Best way to deal with the tokens ATM is Deputy of Detention in the Esper shell, you can bounce him with Teferi, rinse and repeat.


To kill the few first tokens it's ok, but that does nothing against the big instant speed Scapesift for in between 16(with 8 lands)-56(14 lands) zombies in your turn

...unless you have Vivien, Champion of the Wilds, I mean (or one of the red little instant speed sweepers, Flame Sweep or the ole Fiery Cannonade)

The problem isn't Scapesift or Field of the Dead, the problem, as usual, is lil Teferi


Like this post
Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Aug 05, 2019 2:51 pm 
Offline
Member

Joined: Oct 13, 2016
Posts: 1832
Best way to deal with the tokens ATM is Deputy of Detention in the Esper shell, you can bounce him with Teferi, rinse and repeat.


To kill the few first tokens it's ok, but that does nothing against the big instant speed Scapesift for in between 16(with 8 lands)-56(14 lands) zombies in your turn

...unless you have Vivien, Champion of the Wilds, I mean (or one of the red little instant speed sweepers, Flame Sweep or the ole Fiery Cannonade)

The problem isn't Scapesift or Field of the Dead, the problem, as usual, is lil Teferi


You can target 3-mana Teferi with Deputy too. It honestly seems like the single best sideboard card against Scapeshift: versatile, hard for the deck to answer, effective.


Like this post
Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Aug 05, 2019 6:46 pm 
Offline
Member
User avatar

Joined: Nov 25, 2015
Posts: 1431
Preferred Pronoun Set: Xhir/xhim, depending on Moon phase
Banedon wrote:

You can target 3-mana Teferi with Deputy too. It honestly seems like the single best sideboard card against Scapeshift: versatile, hard for the deck to answer, effective.


I dunno, I prefer Ego...Deputy is nice for tokens cause he makes them disapear, not like Teferi...and he looks a bit too busy if he must deal with 4 Tefis and 4 Shifts. I see him more like the best edge in the mirror match


Like this post
Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Aug 07, 2019 1:08 pm 
Offline
Member
User avatar

Joined: Jul 28, 2015
Posts: 5102
Identity: Male
Preferred Pronoun Set: uhhhhh
Ego is definitely the cleanest answer. If you resolve it on Turn 3, most decks will not have a Field of the Dead on the battlefield because they need to be prioritizing mana producing lands to keep ramping. And if you can take out 3 of their 4 Field of the Deads, that's still pretty good, as it reduces their number of zombies to non-fatal until they have 10 lands to scapeshift, so you can soak a hit before sweeping.

_________________
KLD Season King of the Hill Winner.
EMN Season King of the Hill Winner.

The one true King of NGA Magic Duels on Xbox One.

You want some? Come get some. You don't like me? Bite me.

Day 1,000 of the never-ending Vert monarchy.

viewtopic.php?f=38&t=16077

Magic's a simple game, 2 people take turns playing cards and in the end Divinevert wins 2-0...


Like this post
Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Aug 07, 2019 4:42 pm 
Offline
Member
User avatar

Joined: Apr 30, 2015
Posts: 2223
What are scapeshifts bad matchups? It's not control decks because they don't even really need to cast it and can just outvalue you with zombies, and whenever i'm on aggro i never seem to be able to outrace them if they have a Graser or elf or two

_________________
Future Actual winner of Steam Showdown 5.
I have a Magic Youtube channel, check it out here!
https://www.youtube.com/c/Nighthawk233


Like this post
Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Aug 07, 2019 5:04 pm 
Offline
Member
User avatar

Joined: Nov 25, 2015
Posts: 1431
Preferred Pronoun Set: Xhir/xhim, depending on Moon phase
What are scapeshifts bad matchups? It's not control decks because they don't even really need to cast it and can just outvalue you with zombies, and whenever i'm on aggro i never seem to be able to outrace them if they have a Graser or elf or two


In my experience, besides the mentioned Bant Ramp, the new more agressive Vamp shells, Jund dinos and Azorious fliers are the ones with better chance of going under fast enough


Like this post
Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Aug 07, 2019 5:29 pm 
Offline
Member
User avatar

Joined: Jan 19, 2014
Posts: 1151
Location: San Francisco Bay Area
Just Switcheroo your Marauding Raptor for their Arboreal Grazer.

OK, you also need to Ixalan's Binding their Teferi.


Like this post
Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Aug 07, 2019 7:38 pm 
Offline
Member
User avatar

Joined: Sep 29, 2015
Posts: 1220
Location: Bend, OR
Mayhem Devil can make Scapeshifting quite a bit more painful. Just played vs Scapeshift with my Bloody Mess and they cast 3 Krassis but never tried a Scapeshift since I had them down below 10 by the time they hit 7 lands.

_________________
Twitch: https://www.twitch.tv/wintervoidx
YouTube https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCZ4WOy ... BgwzjA-FsQ


Like this post
Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Aug 07, 2019 11:14 pm 
Offline
Member

Joined: Oct 13, 2016
Posts: 1832
What are scapeshifts bad matchups? It's not control decks because they don't even really need to cast it and can just outvalue you with zombies, and whenever i'm on aggro i never seem to be able to outrace them if they have a Graser or elf or two


Nexus is Scapeshift's worst nightmare. They are too slow to race the combo, which leaves playing around it, but their only pieces of interaction are Deputy of Detention (if they have it maindeck) and T3feri. The former is not the most effective of hate cards, and the latter can also be worked around. Of course it's possible to lose, e.g. if they're able to Scapeshift on turn 5 with T3feri on turn 3 as LSV did in the GP finals, but overall it's a tough matchup.

It's likely Vampires with maindeck Legion's End is also a bad matchup (hence all the MPL players playing it), and Andrea Mengucci claimed Izzet Wizards is also good against it (have literally not seen the deck however, don't know how true that is).


Like this post
Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Thu Aug 08, 2019 1:59 am 
Offline
Member
User avatar

Joined: Nov 25, 2015
Posts: 1431
Preferred Pronoun Set: Xhir/xhim, depending on Moon phase
Banedon wrote:
and Andrea Mengucci claimed Izzet Wizards is also good against it (have literally not seen the deck however, don't know how true that is).


Mengu tends to be way too optimistic...but I'll try the deck, i think I jave all the cards


Like this post
Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Aug 11, 2019 2:29 pm 
Offline
Member

Joined: Oct 13, 2016
Posts: 1832
Do you still think Bant ramp has a favorable matchup vs. Scapeshift? I'm not having faith in the deck right now - only played BO1, but boy is Finale a bad card and I don't see how I can clock Scapeshift fast enough such that I still need to board in Negate etc and rely on countering Teferi / Scapeshift and grinding through the zombies.


Like this post
Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Aug 12, 2019 5:03 am 
Offline
Member
User avatar

Joined: Oct 02, 2013
Posts: 5379
Location: 1,824.5 meters underground.
Preferred Pronoun Set: Mr.
I've beat it every time with my Azorius LD deck. Plenty of countermagic until I hit the combo and ruin their day.

_________________
It is better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to open one's mouth and remove all doubt. - Maurice Switzer


Come and enjoy the best of sim racing action. Please subscribe.
https://www.youtube.com/@shakeymark4969/videos
My band Shakey Deal YouTube channel
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCBpPU1fbAjSPTfu3g0vubLw
Shakey Deal Facebook
https://www.facebook.com/ShakeyDeal.Neil.Young.tribute/


Like this post
Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue Aug 13, 2019 1:25 pm 
Offline
Member
User avatar

Joined: Aug 08, 2018
Posts: 595
Yondar wrote:

This is a beautiful idea :D

Not that that'd go into any standard deck though.


Like this post
Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 18 posts ] 

All times are UTC - 6 hours [ DST ]


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group