I opened a 4th Jace so I'm trying out the self-mill deck, the poor man's version. I'm down to 1UC and 1MR wild card so yeah... Here's the decklist and the thoughts behind some of it. Keep in mind, I've seen https://www.mtggoldfish.com/deck/1853157#arena but I don't have Dream Eater, Precog, Drowned Secrets or even a single Finale of Revelation.

3 x Opt
4 x Blink of an Eye
2 x Lazotep Plating
4 x Wall of Lost Thoughts
4 x Jace's Triumph
2 x Narset, Parter of Veils
4 x No Escape
3 x Saheeli, Sublime Artificer
2 x Bond of Insight
1 x God-Eternal Kefnet
4 x Jace, Wielder of Mysteries
3 x Tamiyo's Epiphany
1 x River's Rebuke
23 x Island


The goal is to get Saheeli, or Narset (who can search for Saheeli), in your opening hand. I'll frequently mull to 6 without them, not always, but often. Due to Saheeli's ability I often don't even Opt on T1 as most often Saheeli comes out T4 so I can Opt for a 1/1 to defend her. The Walls are also there for defense and they help drive the mill engine. Kefnet is my only defense against flying, other than counterspells and bounce. He doesn't do quite as much as the Dream Eater, but if he hits a draw spell it's almost as good. Plus; he's harder to permanently remove.

Bond of Insight is for getting those key defensive cards like River's Rebuke or No Escape back. If I don't need those it'll recycle that draw for the win.


Feed back I'm looking for is; as I gain more wildcards, what should I look to replace first? The Dream Eater? Should I spring for Precognitive Perception or Drowned Secrets when I get rares, or do you think those are to slow and there are better options in Arena? I think Radical Idea will end up being the first thing I add to the deck.

For those replacements, or others if you have an idea of a card that I have overlooked, what should I take out.

Is this deck viable in the higher teirs? Right now I think the only reason I struggle (7-3 in Bronze) is because people are running those tribal go-wide decks like goblins, zombies and merfolk. That's why I go with Saheeli over Ashiok because she can help protect against that, where as he can't. Is Ashiok a better option at the higher teirs because there are less people playing go-wide decks? The other decklists I see don't have defense against go-wide so I feel like it's not an issue in Standard, so their decklists look different than mine. Surprised not to see Bond of Insight in anyone's deck.

You might be interested: https://www.reddit.com/r/spikes/comment ... i_suicide/ Of course that's three colors and the wildcards are going to be hard to acquire.

Speaking of which: why not just play monored? You could make a respectable monored deck for not-too-many wildcards - maindeck you could get away with just Runaway Steam-Kin and Experimental Frenzy, Goblin Chainwhirler too if you're playing against the decks you describe - and use that to grind more wildcards. The problem with spending wildcards on stuff like Dream Eater and Precognitive Perception is they're a little weak in terms of power level, and aren't seeing play in any of the top decks right now.

Absolutely! RDW is my bag. I currently use Draft to grind free packs, thus grinding WCs. Once Ranked Draft is over it's back to Traditional Draft which just feeds me free packs. Except this week. I've been grinding wins in "Counters" cuz my deck owns.

I get you on Dream Eater, drowned secrets and Precog. I don't necessarily want those cards either, I just wanted to get any of the obvious suggestions for mono-blue Jace out in the open. I much prefer the look of the Dimir Jace deck but that'll take even longer to build up. I'm just looking for something fun to play on the side, and since I pulled 4 jaces from drafts I figured I'd go for it.

Maybe I'll just spend the wild card I have on a Finale of Revolution and replace a Tamiyo's Epiphany and be done with it for now. Hopefully someone has some insight on a card I'm overlooking though.

Love you brought up Rebuke as a key defense. It has treated me so well in my Simic Ramp. I use Gaea's Blessing to get it back. Heck it's been a few weeks since I played it. Here's to hoping I have a Simic quest to do when I get home from work.
It's not a Jace deck but let me show you anyway. I'm sure it's too expensive for you to build at the moment but it's something to maybe try to build similar in the future. I have a lot of wins under it's belt. Too bad Tyrant is rotating in October. Wonder if we will see its like again? Most efficient thing to do is replace them with Nissa then. I love Nissa now but this deck is really hard for me to edit anymore.
Sorry for going off topic but I thought you might like this.

4 x Island
3 x River's Rebuke
6 x Forest
2 x Circuitous Route
2 x Gaea's Blessing
2 x Pelakka Wurm
3 x Carnage Tyrant
1 x Nezahal, Primal Tide
4 x Hinterland Harbor
1 x Arch of Orazca
4 x Llanowar Elves
2 x Vivien Reid
4 x Hydroid Krasis
2 x Elfhame Druid
3 x Chemister's Insight
2 x Gift of Paradise
2 x Memorial to Genius
2 x Secrets of the Golden City
2 x Incubation Druid
3 x Sleep
2 x Vivien, Champion of the Wilds
4 x Breeding Pool

I ended up making it to Platinum with a watered down RDW:

4 x Fanatical Firebrand
4 x Shock
4 x Lava Coil
4 x Lightning Strike
4 x Runaway Steam-Kin
2 x Viashino Pyromancer
1 x Krenko, Tin Street Kingpin
2 x Risk Factor
2 x Skewer the Critics
3 x Tibalt, Rakish Instigator
3 x Chandra, Fire Artisan
3 x Rekindling Phoenix
2 x Banefire
22 x Mountain


What suggestions do you have for my next unlocks? I'm thinking 2 Chainwhirlers but do you think I should go 3? Or is the Legion Warboss better? I've had a Warboss played against me a few times and it never got out of hand except once or twice but I feel the same way about Krenko. Sometimes he's great, but most times he dies before he can attack. I have a 4th Phoenix but 7 cards at 4cmc make me have to mulligan more often with only 22 lands. I can't decide to go 4 chandra/2 phoenix or 2 Chandra/4 Phoenix so I just keep it 3/3. Chandra is a Card Advantage king and they get reluctant to attack her after she smacks them once real good so I can ult her against most decks that don't have straight removal for her, so anything Black or White.

Tibalt is my sub-par choice for dealing with lifegain decks. He puts in work some games, but often he's just a token or two. But those tokens aren't bad, they can do something the Firebrand's can't, take down a X/2 creature. He's slated for replacement by the Chainwhirlers/Warboss'.

It took a while to get all 4 Steam-kin. When you have two of those out, you can play pretty much every card in the deck if you had infinite draw.

Also, what do you think about the burn package? 4 Shock, 4 Lightning Strike, 4 Lava Coil, 2 Risk Factor, 2 Skewer the Critic, 2 Banefire. 2 Skewers and a Lightning Strike used to be Chandra's Triumph because they can hit bigger creatures with Chandra out. Unfortunately, they don't hit the face. I made the swap when I went down to 3 Chandras in the deck from 4.


I'm still working on the Jace deck. I think I'm going to go BU. I like that deck with Ashiok, the Narcomebas, the Surveil and the black 1 drop 1/1 that mills 6.

I still don't have the Steam Kins. I keep spending my rares on land.

Grrrrr.... this dimir decklist is doing worse than the UUU