Correction, I want to play a deck with Iorveth and Swordmasters The Eithne deck is on my to-do list though. Regarding Summoning Circle, I would suggest Mandrake or Expired Ale, but I have no experience with the deck.

Have you played with the Heymaey Battle Maiden deck? That deck looks awfully strong to me, with strong early tempo courtesy of Wolfsbane, and a startling ability to generate points.

Oh hey, when did we play? Was it on PC?

Not recently, though I have played it before and slightly after the Restore nerf.
I think the deck has quite a lot of potential (mainly because I think Battle Maiden is a very good card), but I haven't found a build I am comfortable enough with. There's way too many ways to build the deck and I don't really have the time to test extensively rn. Heck, I'm not even sure if King Bran or Crach an Craite is the better leader for the archetype - Bran has Wolfsbane, Crach puts two wounded units and carryover onto the battlefield at will.

Mandrake is the card I've been replacing Circle with so far; it's okay but not great.

Currently #21 ranked with this


(Emhyr)

Was playing a more traditional version with iris/vilgefortz/muzzle/etc for most of the season but I just like the increased consistency of this and the ability to bleed down to one card, knowing that the r3 renew rainfarn finisher will be higher than anything they can muster.

I also liked running Guardian but it gets muzzled too often and you can't fit counter-muzzle in this version, also Peter is very necessary with the amount of Eithnes currently.

I made that post shortly after I played the games. Was it you? I thought you didn't play casual mode. Yes, it was on PC.

@modulo, I'm thinking of porting some of the Eithne ale package into Handbuff. Handbuff at present is short a few cards, which I imagine is why the Gwent open didn't have any handbuff decks. I have space for like four, maybe five, bronze cards. If handbuff could run 6 Swordmasters in the same deck I'm confident the deck would vault to top tier, even if Quen were capped at 3 units. I figure it's possible to run some Sages with Elven Mercenaries / Ales in those slots. iirc Sage can also flashback Ida's spells, including Clear Skies. Unfortunately I can't run three copies of all three cards. What kind of split would you suggest? The only other spell in the deck right now is Quen.

There appears to be an occasional bug where Madroeme doesn't reset Dol Blathanna Protector. I still have Scorch in the deck for that reason.

@Ordev are you not afraid of weather? Also how does Guardian get Muzzled - it's got 11 power (?)

There are damage effects in every deck except consume.

As for weather, Vanhemar isn't even good enough if you bounce him twice against Eredin, they'll just end up using Caretaker on him for another frost later. I'd rather just force out all their cards and win a short r3.
There are no slots for Vanhemar at the moment and it seems like anyone running weather is being bullied out by Eithne. I'd consider him instead of Peter if golden weather returns.

Yeah, Eredin really only needs one active weather to be effective.

My Eredin decks must be outdated. No surprises since I've barely played Eredin recently. All the other Eredins I'm playing against are running Iris + what appears to be 3x Riders, which I have generally understood as overkill. White Frost appears to be uncommon now, no idea why.

Re handbuff, boy is the deck frustrating. The core of the deck is fine, but there is a massive power disparity between some cards and others. If I start with the following hand I'm confident I can beat everyone: 3x Swordmasters 3x Dragoons Iorveth Ithlinne Renew Isengrim (for cherry on cake, 3 Wardancers that mulliganed into any of these cards). On the other hand because there's such a massive power disparity between some cards and others, I'm often stuck with hands that contain DB Archer, Sage, Alzur's Thunder, and other situational cards that I had no choice but to run, since I simply didn't have other options. Francesca can only help so much in consistency.

There doesn't appear to be a good solution. The handbuff package comes with ~5 free bronze slots. I could put in movement elves, but they're low value without synergy and there's no space for the synergy. I tried spells (Elven Merc + Sage + Ale) but these cards really need to be run in multiple copies to be effective, plus I get so much less value from these cards than Eithne does, and they're hard to use given I also need to row stack for Toruviel. There's mulligan, but Vrihedd Officers conflict with handbuff since they buff off the unit's base power not current power, plus this makes round 3 mulligans especially bad since mulligan doesn't take the card out of the deck and there's a chance I draw a card like Vanguard that I really don't want. The last option is to run Clear Skies as thinning, but that falls flat on its face because there's a chance to pull out a Wardancer, plus the deck wants to hold its Swordmasters for late-game not pull them out with Rally. To top it off the deck really wants to have access to its key bronze cards, making Saskia great, except 1) she isn't an elf and 2) there's no gold to cut.

Maybe I should just quit and play Eithne.

I have two questions seeking other opinions on, both in terms of deckbuilding and in terms of play:

1) What beats consume (other than Eithne with Artifact Compression and them self-destructing by not drawing Nekkers)? From what I've noticed, I want to win round 1 because otherwise I die to the carryover they can set up in round 2. This is sufficiently important that I won't pass even if it puts me up two cards. Beyond that it's preferable to let them have a locked Nekeer, as opposed to a dead one, since that enables Slyzard. I just lost one game in this way where my opponent drypassed round 2 and I played Ciaran. Leaving the Nekker on the board means they can still Nekker Warrior more copies but the only ways they can re-trigger the Nekker are an unlock or Shadow. (nevermind since they can always consume the Nekker and then Slyzard a new one) Finally keep Scorch since it should kill Unseen Elder. Aside from that I'm not sure.

Question: should I keep killing the Nekkers otherwise? For example, say I have Alzur's Thunder & Sage in hand, and the tempo to use them. Should I nuke and nuke the Nekker? Arachas Behemoth is too big to kill with an Alzur's Thunder sadly.

2) What beats spies? From what I've seen the easiest way for them to lose is to line up two big Brigades to Scorch. Aside from that the core card appears to be the Enforcers (in other words, Ithlinne into double Alzur's Thunder is not happening, since the first Enforcer played is sufficiently threatening to demand immediate removal, and there won't be a time for Ithlinne nuking two Enforcers). They only have three Enforcers, but they're really good at digging for them. I feel like if they ever get two Enforcers on the board and I can't remove them, I should pass. However they run Assire, can shuffle Enforcers back, and then dig them up again with Emissaries.

When I play Eredin the gameplan is generally to frost two rows and then exploit the fact the Enforcers only have 6 power (= dies to Drowner instantly) to keep them down. I found the matchup to be favourable as a result, but it is important to have White Frost & Caranthir since otherwise the opponent will just stack a single row. Emhyr into double Vanmehar is crippling as a result. If Vanmehar dies (it can be killed with Wild Hunt Warrior) then it can also be Caretaker'ed for an extra frost. What do other decks do?

Has anyone tried Schirru after the gold immunity change? The card looks big enough to potentially Scorch itself; on the other hand it's also a hard counter to stuff like Operator and Foul Ale, and it allows you to run more thinning since you can always turn a bad card into Scorch (assuming you don't Scorch yourself of course). I don't have the card and don't see it played against me. Anyone?

Nah, I think Schirru is one of those golds that were on the losing end of the gold immunity change and needs some rebalancing. I tried to make a new Scorch deck after the gold immunity change, but I never got anywhere with it.

Well, I had crafted Schirru so I thought I'd give him a try, and guess what, first game I ran into a poor guy playing Expired Ale. Won round one up a card lol. So far Schirru hasn't actually been bad. Yes, Scorching self is a problem, but he doesn't usually get bigger than ~13 power. Decks playing big units usually well exceed this value. Schirru is able to turn bad cards into Scorch, which not only enables situationally very powerful cards like Vrihedd Brigade, he also frees up a silver slot. Problem: I don't know what's good in that slot ...

My latest iteration of handbuff (aka. Swordmasters + Iorveth) is:

Francesca - Iorveth is just way too good not to have reliable access to.

3x Swordmasters - (core card) self-explanatory.
3x Vrihedd Dragoon - (core card) I tried playing without it and soon realized just how important this card is. I can do without Hawker Supports, but not this one.
3x Elven Wardancer - (core card?) I wouldn't exactly call these 100% core but when they are effective, they are insanely effective. Facing two Wardancers in round 1 on the play is a nightmare for virtually every deck, in fact I don't think I've actually lost a game when that happened. I typically can't keep one in hand for round 2, but if I do draw one in my two cards at the start of round 2, they also prevent a drypass, which is absurdly important against decks such as Axemen or Eredin. The main problem with these is that I can potentially mulligan into one of them in round 3. By then Francesca is typically long gone, so the only recourse is Schirru (or Saskia).
2x Elven Mercenary - (not core) one to cast Alzur's Thunder, the other to cast Quen. They're Elves which is great with Iorveth.
1x Alzur's Thunder - (not core) provides valuable interaction. This kills Dwarven Marauder, Siege Support, Axemen in round 1, non-buffed Dragoons. Pretty important.
1x Quen - (not core?) I have mixed feelings about this card. Yes it makes the Swordmasters much better, but finding the tempo to cast it is hard. Even if I cast it, it's not that good. In the best case scenario where I have all three Swordmasters in hand, it makes Mercenary a base 13-power card, but I often don't have all three Swordmasters in hand.
1x Sage - (not core) to recast Alzur's Thunder which can be crucial vs. the units it kills. Otherwise it generally recasts Ida's Overdose. It is possible to be stuck with a mostly-dead Sage, but it doesn't happen often (and there's Schirru). Warning: Sage cannot recast Fog and Clear Skies! I threw a game because of this!
1x Vrihedd Brigade - Eredin these days don't seem to be running a lot of weather. In that case Clear Skies isn't exactly a good counter. Brigade does make my mulligan more awkward, but again, there's Schirru.

1x Ida - (not core) mostly used to cast Overdose and Clear Skies. Clear Skies is critical against gold weather. Otherwise she's not that good and also somewhat contradictory since I have to play her early for max Fog value, but late for max Overdose value. On the bright side she is an elf.
1x Toruviel - (core card?) because of Isengrim.
1x Yaevinn - (core card?) spies are just really good in general. There are a few problems however. First he's an Elf, which means I want to play him before Iorveth; on the other hand this typically means it's really early in the round and if my opponent passes I might not be able to catch up in one card. For example say I play against Eredin and draw no Wardancers. He goes first and plays Hound. I play Yaevinn. He passes. I'm down 16 points and I can't get that. This happens quite a bit especially since the main points generator Isengrim does not work when the opponent has passed. The other issue is that he draws a spell. I only have three spells, two of which aren't meant to be drawn. If I already have Renew in hand, then it's conceivably he draws spell + Roach and then I go "oops".
1x Roach - (core card?) early tempo boost since he's almost always pulled out by a turn 2 or 3 Iorveth. This puts the opponent under pressure since I can threaten to pass pretty soon.
1x Ciaran - (not core) provides interaction, is an elf. Worth a lot of points in general. I don't think there's a better option since the ST silver slots are rather barren.
1x something - any ideas? I'd imagine a spell would be better to help with the 2nd Yaevinn problem, but I don't know what. So far I've played one game with Alzur's Double Cross, but that game I wound up mulliganing ADC since I already had Yaevinn in hand in round 3, and I can't mulligan Yaevinn since ADC will pull it; further even if no Yaevinn, it pulls Brigade which is not always good.

1x Iorveth - (core card) absurdly powerful, so powerful I'm running Renew.
1x Renew - (core card) Iorveth is just too good. Even in a short round 3, Iorveth will typically pull his weight.
1x Isengrim - (core card?) the thing about Isengrim is that he puts so much power onto the board in a single move. Assuming he's been buffed by Iorveth, that's 8 + 14 = 22. Coupled with Wardancers, it's very possible I tempo the opponent out in round 1.
1x Schirru - (not core) so far he's been pulling his weight, but he's definitely not spectacular either.

Other options

Blue Mountain Commandos - I considered these to help with thinning, which in turns helps me access Swordmasters better. The problem is stress the mulligan too much. My experience playing Harpy Eredin last patch indicates that ~8 must-mulligan cards are about the maximum. Francesca can help, but even then, if I run these I have 3 (Wardancer) + 2 (BMCs) + 1 (Roach) +1 (Quen) +1 (Alzur's) +1 (Brigade) +1 (Toruviel) = 10. I have yet to try these with Schirru, but my impression when I tried them was that I needed Saskia.

DB Archer - I had this card in place of Brigade for most of my climb so far. It is either critical or mediocre. It is critical when it pushes a key unit to Iorveth / Thunder kill range; it is mediocre otherwise. The key units are: buffed Dragoons, Shani'd Siege Support, round 2+ Axemen.

Vrihedd Officers & the mulligan package - the big problem with these cards is that they waste the power generated by Dragoons. Vrihedd Officers buff off the base power, not the boosted one. When I tried them the round 3 mulligan nightmare was an issue but not an insurmountable one; on the other hand I had trouble generating enough points.

Aelirenn - I find that without BMCs I can't reliably pull her. On the other hand if I do run BMCs, she exacerbates the mulligan issue.

Hattori - this card has persistently underwhelmed. Yes I can bring back Ida, but Ida's only getting played in a long round and is probably not dying either, which means I can only play Hattori next round. But if I just went past a long round, Ida won't be that good when resurrected. There isn't any other good option unelss he reaches 6 power, in which case Toruviel might be plausible, but that requires Dragoons to buff him. I feel like the real card to bring back with Hattori is Barclay Els, which is not in the deck.

Saskia - helps me access my core cards, i.e. Swordmasters & Dragoons. The problem though is that she is just so bad if I don't have any must-mulligan cards. Upgrading a DB Archer into a Swordmaster is good, but to spend a low-tempo gold card on is not so good. DB Archers are 10 points, potentially 11-12+ since they've probably been buffed by Iorveth and / or Dragoons. A freshly-drawn Swordmaster is 12 power at best, if I've already cast Quen. In theory she sounds good, but when I tried her I've been less than impressed. Still an option, but not an impressive one.

Ithlinne - Ithlinne is also hit-or-miss. If I have multiple Dragoons & Swordmasters in hand, her double Quen is quite good. But if I don't she's so very mediocre. The only other purpose would be double Thunder, but that itself would be a disaster, since all these must-kill cards really should die immediately when they land.

Muzzle - I have mixed feelings about this card. It's annoying when a Dragoon gets taken by it, but aside from it also seems hit-or-miss. I could take Enforcers for example, but I can't use them. At that point why not just Alzur's Thunder it with Elven Mercenary? Other units could be Nekkers (possibly vital, but they can grow out of Muzzle range), Morkvarg (okay), buffed Dragoons, stuff my opponent Muzzled from me. I don't feel any of these units are all that critical, i.e. Muzzling one of these doesn't usually win me the game. And when it misses, it misses pretty badly.

I have still not found a configuration I am fully satisfied with. Hoping for someone else to discuss things with!

EDIT: Thinking of Myrgtabrakke in that slot. Would enable Iorveth given no more DB Archers. Potential combo with Scorch, but very underwhelming otherwise.

Another dev stream happened and here's a quick summary:
- Next patch is going to hit mid to late december with slightly more than 109 cards (sic).
- 20 cards were revealed during the stream and can be looked up here: https://www.playgwent.com/en/card-reveals

In other news: I'm playing spellatael all the way until the day the patch hits, because after the patch most people will probably run Geralt:Yrden and shiver at the thought of that card being played against me in round 3...

Here's my final iteration of handbuff. I'm also done with the deck. It has its good matchups, but it also has a lot of bad ones, and it's just not capable of any particularly-unfair plays such as Mercenary into Ale generating 13 points + Farseer trigger + DB Protector trigger, 14-power Nekker carrying over another 14-power Nekker, and Iris into Caretaker + Iris for 54 points. It's also very hard to pilot and I find I lose a lot of games by narrow margins thanks to small mistakes like not stacking a row in advance for Toruviel. I peaked at ~4100 MMR with this, but by that point my win rate had dropped to ~50%, which is a far cry from my smooth climb to ~4250 MMR with Eredin last patch. It's conceivable a very careful player playing perfectly will reach 4250+, but that player won't be me. Handbuff is still good enough to be a tier-two deck, but no more.

3x Dragoons
3x Swordmasters
3x Wardancers
2x Elven Mercenary
1x Alzur's Thunder
1x Quen
1x Sage
1x Brigade

1x Ida
1x Toruviel - it's conceivable Morenn is better since Toruviel is rarely buffed by Iorveth, plus people seem to have stopped respecting Morenn, plus I'm getting locks aimed at Toruviel very often.
1x Yaevinn
1x Roach
1x Ciaran
1x Scorch

1x Iorveth
1x Renew
1x Isengrim
1x Eskel - the newest addition and one I'm happy with, since it instantly kills Yaevinn. If this deck goes second, it tends to have a huge advantage thanks to Wardancers + the Yaevinn / Eskel combo.

I think I'll try Eithne next. Either that, or switch back to Eredin. Lurker if you're also playing Spelltael, are you using swim's version as modulo posted last page? Ironically, my handbuff list has a strong (albeit skill-intensive) matchup vs. Eithne, simply because Wardancers destroy the Eithne drypassing plan.

I have no comment about the new revealed cards, except boy, I'm running out of time to climb the ladder (again). I do wish they nerf Iris next patch though. That card generates 21-25 power, which is well above other silvers (e.g. Ida into Overdose is 15 points, Jotunn at max value is 15 points, Commander's Horn is 20 points) and even competitive with golds (Isengrim bringing out Toruviel is 21 points, Imlerith is 17 points, etc). Sure, she's not easy to set up, but the payoff for successfully setting her up is too high.

No, I'm not using swim's version (I assume that's the one with Mahakam Ale and Muzzle). I'm still in the gold weather sub-archetype. Ironically enough, my win rate against muzzle/ale spellatael is kinda bad

Is it just me or have people got better ... I netdecked a standard Eredin list, and still have not been able to climb above 4100 mmr ...

I was basically a .500 player with mill. I ended up getting super into a Madden 18 league, so I've been playing less and less. I can't wait for the new cards to hopefully spike my interest back up and provide new strategies (or a more resilient mill strategy).

I wonder how you stayed interested in Magic for so long divinevert, considering your fickleness w.r.t games to play

I reached 4250 MMR with Eredin, now trying to play pro ladder so I don't drop out of it. Is it just me or are there no players at all there? I queued 10 minutes having not played a single pro ladder game this season, and found nothing.

Magic was smart enough to have the treadmill of new cards. As soon as that ended, so did my interest.

I have every deck basically built at this point in Gwent, so until builds change, ill just coasting.

Going into round 3 vs. Emhyr spies with the following hand: 3x Vrihedd Dragoon, 1x Swordmaster, 1x Isengrim (with Morenn still in deck), 1x Toruviel, 1x Vrihedd Vanguard, 1x Vrihedd Brigade. I was up 8 cards to 6, and many of these cards had already been buffed by Iorveth, some twice. A bunch of vicissitudes later involving me playing around a Muzzle he didn't have, he thinned to his last card and put out 84 points. Meanwhile I put out 86. What? He only managed to answer one of my Dragoons (with Menno) and still lost by only two points?

I swear I have a love-hate relationship with the handbuff deck. It just feels so underpowered, it's incredible I pinned it as one of the two most broken decks along with Restore Skellige at the start of the season ...

Also @modulo, if you've not seen it, results indicate going first costs ~15% in win rate: http://gwentlemen.com/mz-s-lessons-the-coinflip-survey/. Very much looking forward to a fix to this, because the disparity is very large.