I was not thinking about banning decks that can win on turn two, just making them wait till turn six.

What thatmarkguy suggest actually sound quite close to what I had in mind. I'm quite sure there is some broken stuff this enables, but hey, that's the intent anyway, and we can always add some bans.

doesn't this not do much in actual practice and in effect become just another version of vanilla

(although it stops wall of blood)

chronatog might be an issue but loop rules should cover that, as the chronatog controller actually has to take the mandatory five turns rather than skipping every turn, so eventually that loses

I would argue that, in order to skip a turn, you have to acknowledge its existence. So even if you skip turns 2 thru 5, they are still considered to have happened (even though absolutely nothing happened during those turns).

Edit: Apparently I would be arguing on the wrong side. I realized shortly after posting that technically there is a card that could cover what happens in the scenario of a Chronatog eating turns away and whether those turns are considered to have happened. I also looked up turn skipping in the Comp Rules. Comp Rules say that skipping something is the same as "Instead of doing {something}, do nothing." So "Skip your next turn" is "Instead of starting your next turn, do nothing." And as far as the card is concerned, it literally only counts the turns you've taken. So if you skip turns indefinitely, you won't be able to cast it*.

I would think giving combo and control decks the guaranteed time to be able to get their lock or combo or defense established when their usual failing point is being too slow to withstand aggro would result in a different meta.

I'm unconvinced it would be _good_ (I wasn't suggesting a format, I was suggesting a wording for implementing the ideals of Zlen's format idea), but I do think it would be substantially different from vanilla.

i actually have some alternate round ideas for once, maybe even with good names





not convinced that i need the land play cap for all that mana unless i'm missing some obvious t1 threat between 5 and 12 mana that supersedes enough of the other threats (sun's champion, in particular, was what i was thinking of), instant/sorcery token generators might be problematic with safely in the hand but that's an easy fix to make

I have a suggestion for your first idea: no cards in your hand can be lands or reference lands in the rules text. And the second one, ban LED.

LED is no worse an offender than Spirit Guides and Lotus Petal. They all do the same thing by this rule ... infinite mana. Hell, the Spirit Guides are infinite mana on your opponent's first upkeep, on the draw. LED and Lotus Petal might be too slow, in that they only go infinite during your main phase.

I mean, Elvish Spirit Guide + Vitality Charm is any finite number of any finite number power-and-toughness creatures on your opponent's first upkeep (and able to pump again anytime after). Never mind what your third card might do (Leyline of Vitality, so you have infinite life before your opponent's first main phase, too?)

ok, so fast mana is not surprisingly the bigger problem (the only way to beat it is fast mana itself, because the hate decks are really narrow and weak)

that probably means that led/lotus petal/guides need to be banned