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PostPosted: Thu Dec 08, 2016 12:26 pm 
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If we vote on these things, I would say "No" to LandRule in Vanilla. This is "Three Card Magic" not "Three Spell Magic."

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PostPosted: Thu Dec 08, 2016 1:04 pm 
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That's because storage land decks have been unviable because first turn threat+disruption has been a thing. Tidehollow Sculler, Mesmeric Fiend, Brain Maggot, Meddling Mage... these have been problems, and their existence has been either dissuading storage and depletion land decks, or squishing them. They've been slowly getting banned one by one, and now we're at the point that complaints about too long a banlist are coming up. Would things get better if these ruled again?

I am beginning to think the real problem is T1 disruption, mtgs' game has long banned all first turn hand disruption, and I'm beginning to see the wisdom in that. When so many decks can wreck any hand that doesn't play out on T1, that just pushes all decks towards being able to play out on T1.

I am also wondering if we want to make LandRule (each turn you can play a basic land from outside the game) a part of 'vanilla' - decks could have more varied threats and more of a long game if they didn't have to devote slots to land and have to play the speed-or-storage guessing game. And a single disrupt wouldn't likely be game-over.

I am open to changing the discard rule. It would take away one of the (minor) weaknesses of Lotus decks, but it makes the world a lot safer for slower decks. Interestingly, it looks like MTGS bans any deck that could win or disrupt the opponent's hand before the opponent's second turn, which would also ban turn 2 discard (and turn 2 wins).

My initial feelings about the Land Rule are that it's too much of a deviation from the core of 3CM.

Maybe we should have an experimental season where instead of alternate formats, we just do Vanilla four times, testing out different rules.

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PostPosted: Thu Dec 08, 2016 4:54 pm 
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land rule could probably replace the vanilla redux round, that way there are two distinct vanilla formats


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PostPosted: Fri Dec 09, 2016 12:29 pm 
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I'm banning Elspeth, Sun's Champion, Karn Liberated, and Ugin, the Spirit Dragon. No planeswalkers allowed.

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PostPosted: Fri Dec 09, 2016 3:48 pm 
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Now you're just daring people to beat you with Liliana and Ajani.


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PostPosted: Fri Dec 09, 2016 6:53 pm 
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or the many other versions of elspeth


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PostPosted: Fri Dec 09, 2016 11:41 pm 
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or the two other versions of elspeth



:fixed:

Which I add are both cheaper to cast and one just has the absurd token creation as a minus ability. But her plus ability on that card is life gain.

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