Yep. Exactly. Finisher are Kytheon's Tactics, retreat to Emeria, and Gideon (obviously). Everything else is just the most efficient token producers at every CMC. I'm not at all certain my build is the best it could be, so I haven't posted it yet. But it's already damn good.

I'd really like to get it down to 3 colors, but for now it's just a place holder until next expansion, when I expect it to get significantly better - all it would take is 1, maybe 2 new cards (obviously not just rares or mythics, we need an uncommon/common or two).

It will surely still be a four color mana base (even after the expansion), unless we get an all color mana producer in the expansion, and then maybe it can drop to 3.

I've been using Auunj's deck above with rather satisfying results. I'm not sold on the Runed Servitor, though. Been considering a few options to replace them, such as:

-Aligned Hedron Network - In case the opponent somehow manages to get a lot of bombs out (which hasn't really happened)
-Tide Drifter - Looks the most promising at the moment: would allow thopters to dodge Boiling Earth + nice blocker!
-Tightening Coils - Would remove a potential flying blocker
-Fiery Impulse - For extra annoying weenie removal

I'll test the changes momentarily, but was wondering if anyone already had or simply had thoughts.

(Will also switch a Mountain for a Foundry of the Consuls - I rarely find myself in situations where I lack mana, and the Foundries have been useful to rebuild quickly after board wipes. I feel the other special lands aren't worth the potential slow start... Has anyone tried them in a thotper deck?)

Glad to hear you like it. I'd definitely add some counterspells to the deck to prevent wipes.

True, but at the point where I'd have enough mana saved for counters, I should have a back-up hand already...

I've gone 7-3 with the unmodified version, and my three losses were:

1) Vs a Mardu deck where I was mana-screwed (2 mana in 7 turns?) and opponent had two planeswalkers and one legendary (forgot which) out by the time I gave up;
2) Vs a Simic token army deck, again opponent had two planeswalkers out (I still haven't drawn a single one and I'm down to the last 7 boosters of Origins!) and a healthy number of Fog and other damage negating cards. It was actually a fun game, will try and emulate his/her deck! ;
3) Vs an Esper flyer deck, which was a drawn-out battle, but opponent had two Esperzoa and two Alchemist's Vial out early whereas I did not. I supppose a counter would have blocked one of the vials, but I doubt it would have made much of a difference. Again, Esper flyers looked fun!

I also realized I don't have any of my proposed changes unlocked yet, so it will be a while before I can try them out!

I've been working on a tuned version of my old thopters/larceny deck and am pretty happy where I ended up at.

Antipode
4 x Fiery Impulse
3 x Perilous Myr
4 x Alchemist's Vial
4 x Disperse
1 x Ravaging Blaze
2 x Rolling Thunder
4 x Spell Shrivel
4 x Artificer's Epiphany
2 x Radiant Flames
3 x Whirler Rogue
2 x Thopter Spy Network
1 x Disciple of the Ring
2 x Willbreaker

10 x Island
5 x Mountain
2 x Smoldering Marsh
2 x Sunken Hollow
2 x Sulfur Falls
3 x Foundry of the Consuls


What I normally look to do is to keep the board as clear as possible saving my counters for big threats or for Willbreaker protection, for instance I'd never cast her turn five but wait until I had enough mana for her and at least a disperse. It's definitely not the most optimal pile for my meta but I do enjoy it when it works

Since Nighthawk will be uploading the games we had together, might as well post the Thopter list I 'm using for those that are curious. It's pretty standard :

3 x Runed Servitor
4 x Perilous Myr
2 x Abbot of Keral Keep
4 x Twin bolt

3 x Pilgrim's Eye
3 x Chief of the Foundry
3 x Vile Aggregate
3 x Thopter Engineer
2 x Exquisite Firecraft

3 x Whirler Rogue
1 x Akoum Firebird
2 x Pia and Kiran Nalaar
2 x Thopter Spy Network
1 x Aligned Hedron Network

7 x Island
8 x Mountain
2 x Sulfur falls
4 x Izzet Guildgate
3 x Foundry of the Consuls


_ Don't skimp on the abbots : the games show why those buggers are good, yes also in Duels, even though I misplay in game 1 and tap the wrong mana, I could've had a Whirler Rogue from him. VS Rakdos I build a trade + force him to use up his mana just to kill the abbot + make his aggregate harmless. Even T2 he's decent because he can put out pressure vs control and made unblockable with Rogue to push him through chumps.

_ Akoum Firebird is good enough on his own. You don't care if it dies and in this sweeper fest environment manasinks are lurvely.

_ Agregates feel better than Reclusive Artificer because of the evasion, but mainly because of the gigantic butt; which survives almost all non-white weepers. Languish/flames my myr + Pilgrim's eye + Aggregate? Fine; you take 2. 'untaps'... Here's a Runed Servitor and a Thopter engineer, you take 6. Did you want cheese with that?
I'm not a fan of the vial + esperzoa like Hakeem because the landtax is just too much for a spike list. Get your card advantage on the board.

_ Aligned Hedron Network, probably can be cut, but I like it as a surprise 1 of. Loved Nighthawk's reaction to it after he slammed Woodland Wanderer on the table G3. Worst comes to worst it's something to tap with rogue or a prowess trigger for abbot, or a thopter factory for the other network. Could replace with Molten Vortex if you have no fear of 6 sweeper decks into Ulamog. Me, I'm a pussy.

_ Finally, only 24 land, because the Pilgrim's eyes and the abbots help with this.

I was always a fan of Flameshadow Conjuring as at least a 1 of in Izzet Thopters because it's the best way to respond if you know a board wipe is coming. Maybe drop a Runed Servitor for one or a pilgrim?

Hey I love johhny thopters too, but that would be a different list. This is the spike list.

If you know a whipe is coming, 80% of the time the best response is to play a thopter foundry and stop adding to the board (unless if by adding you can dramatically shorten the clock). Let em whipe you. EOT make thopters. This deck has no fear of sweepers at all. It has lots of burn, mad card advantage on the board, and great manasinks to hedge your cards in hand for a rainy day.

What this deck loses to is Abzhan Lifegain. 5/6 sweepers + 2 for 1 spot removal for your key single bodies, lifegain up the wazoo; and huge meanies/massive token armies

You can't get much more spikey than a double chief from Flameshadow to boost your tiny fliers

I'm also not convinced abbot is good here as you cannot play him until at least 6 mana or you risk binning a WR or exiling a Firebird. You only have 8 cards that boost it.

If everyone ran abzan lifegain I'd agree with putting Conjuring in. But outside of that I don't feel the deck needs it at all.
This deck has no problem getting to 6 mana. And he' s fine on 5 mana too. and he's a 2 drop vs RDW/control. He fits on T3 if you have nothing else to... maybe you hit a land. Y U no Liek?

The only time I am ever happy with abbot is when I play him on T3 and I don't have a land and he gets it for me or he finds a 1 drop like impulse I can use. In decks that have no 1 drops he looses considerable value imo as I have better things to cast with 6 mana. You would be better off playing Epiphany if you want to draw cards and the 1 toughness is just diarrhea.

That being said I will try this list later today switching the abbots for Flameshadow and see what happens

Also probably get the red tap land that adds first strike and maybe get some of the devoid lightning bolts.

Agree to disagree then. I can understand that if you're suggesting epiphanies / Conjuring your way of playing the deck just differs from mine if you see abbot as an inferior drawspell here.
This is quite an agressive list, Darkshock. I want 2 drops and get on the board and count to 20 (or 27, W/E), but I'd like 2 drops that aren't horrible when topdecked later. VS decks that are faster than this (pretty much only RDW/crats, maybe renown aggro) I want early bodies too.

If I would be building with Epiphany/Conjuring then i'd probably be dorking around with Esperzoa and Alchemist's vial, and counterspells/disperse as well, instead of 24 points (count em) of face burn and huge devoid tramplers.

I like the face burn and trample parts of the deck I just and want optimize them. Having a hasted trampler is a huge combat math surprise.

Hey Rabble, you remember LegenD? Just got matched with him playing another poxy R/G Ramp deck, Moss and Radiant Flames included. I want to thank you for this Thopter deck. Nothing beats having Vile Aggregate and Myr on the board + Hedron Alignment (for his Omnath) and topping a Whirler Rogue with your opponent on 5 life. Solve the puzzle, win a prize! (the prize was rage quitting).

5 games in now, 4 against R/G or W/R/G Ramp and all were wins due to the sheer level of pressure + recovery this has. Vile Aggregate is a star player vs the removal. Fun fact, 2 Omnaths, 2 Hedron Alignments. Still no Ulamog yet.

I wonder if he'll post that vid

That' s 2 for 2 youtubers it has beat up then

I've been playing with that list and I like it a lot. You're completely right about Agregates (though I still haven't pulled 3 of them from packs, so I dropped Chandra, Fire of Kaladesh in it's place)

As to the Hedron question, I went with Part the Waterveil instead. Just going around big creatures 2 turns in a row is a winner, I think.

The one big change I made was removing 2 Gates for Blighted Gorge just for a bit more damage if needed.

I was running this in the previous season, I'm looking for any general advice, and specific ideas on the best Zendikar additions.

Creatures

4 x Faerie Miscreant
2 x Goblin Glory Chaser
2 x Goblin Arsonist
2 x Foundry Street Denizen
2 x Bellows Lizard
2 x Abbot of Keral Keep
2 x Ember Hauler
3 x Jhessian Thief
1 x Avaricious Dragon

Spells

2 x Molten Vortex
3 x Fiery Impulse
4 x Titan's Strength
3 x Infectious Bloodlust
3 x Achor to the Aether

Land

6 x Island
12 x Mountain
2 x Sulfur Falls
2 x Rogue's Passage
2 x Evolving Wilds


The idea was to run a fast blitz, with a little bit of card drawing (theives+fairies) and some scry to optimize those draws. It hits fast, spreads out the buffs, and throws the extra land to the Vortex. It was working pretty good at the end of last season, but I think it's a bit more vulnerable now with Radiant Flames being so popular.

So, what do you suggest? (Pile on the newbie! It's my 2nd post! ... ok, I'm not that new, been playing all the prior Duels and was on the old WotC board occasionally, I'm just new here. Hi!)

Oh, u teaser...

Hi Spaceknight and welcome

First off, as callmemaggit implied, Bellows Lizard should be replaced ASAP. You could go with a full 4 copies of Foundry Street Denizen since you run a lot of red creatures. Mage Ring Bully is also a nice 2 drops that in a lot of cases is the better play than Abbott (2 toughness helps prevent twin bolt 2-for-1)

I'd go:

-3 Anchor to the Ether +3 Telling Time. Cheaper blue spell, instant speed for prowess, helps filter top decks you don't want to see.
-2 Bellows Lizard, +2 Foundry Street Denizen. This will improve the consistency of you main 1 drop.
-4 Faerie Miscreants, +4 Mage Ring Bully. I'm not huge on this Fae, and you have a lot of 1 drops. This guy helps with prowess too.

I'd try those first, as there's other suggestions I could make but they're preference based.