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PostPosted: Tue Nov 19, 2013 8:48 am 
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So in my 3.0 D&D adventure, at some point, there may be monsters that are more advanced than just base stats, by having levels of character classes. So, to use a troll from a previous post, which has a CR of 5, I want to make it a CR of 10. So does that mean just adding 5 character class levels, as in a simple base CR + levels, or does it get more convoluted than that? I'm not really sure, as I have not done that yet.

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PostPosted: Tue Nov 19, 2013 11:02 am 
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It's more convoluted. I can't find a 3.0 SRD online that isn't blocked by my employer's firewall. Here's the text from the 3.5 SRD. I think it was similar, if not the same.

Quote:
ADVANCED MONSTER CHALLENGE RATING
When adding class levels to a creature with 1 or less HD, you advance the creature like a character. Otherwise, use the following guidelines.

ADDING CLASS LEVELS

If you are advancing a monster by adding player character class levels, decide if the class levels directly improve the monster’s existing capabilities.

When adding class levels to a creature, you should give it typical ability scores appropriate for that class. Most creatures are built using the standard array of ability scores: 11, 11, 11, 10, 10, 10, adjusted by racial modifiers. If you give a creature a PC class use the elite array of ability scores before racial adjustments: 15, 14, 13, 12, 10, 8. Creatures with NPC classes use the nonelite array of 13, 12, 11, 10, 9, 8. T

Associated Class Levels

Class levels that increase a monster’s existing strengths are known as associated class levels. Each associated class level a monster has increases its CR by 1.

Barbarian, fighter, paladin, and ranger are associated classes for a creature that relies on its fighting ability.

Rogue and ranger are associated classes for a creature that relies on stealth to surprise its foes, or on skill use to give itself an advantage.

A spellcasting class is an associated class for a creature that already has the ability to cast spells as a character of the class in question, since the monster’s levels in the spellcasting class stack with its innate spellcasting ability.

Nonassociated Class Levels

If you add a class level that doesn’t directly play to a creature’s strength the class level is considered nonassociated, and things get a little more complicated. Adding a nonassociated class level to a monster increases its CR by 1/2 per level until one of its nonassociated class levels equals its original Hit Dice. At that point, each additional level of the same class or a similar one is considered associated and increases the monster’s CR by 1.

Levels in NPC classes are always treated as nonassociated.




Source Link

You can also add extra racial Hit Dice. The link has the ratios based on creature type to determine how many HD are needed to increase the CR.


To figure out the racial modifiers for ability scores (since 3.0 didn't have "as characters" section in the MM, I believe): If the ability score is even, subtract 10; if it's odd subtract 11. This becomes your racial modifier. For example, if a creature has an 18 Str and 8 Wis, its racial mods will be +8 Str and -2 Wis. However, Int can never go below 3.

Fun abuse that I like: give a troll druid levels; they're non-associated, so you get to add a crap ton in relation to the racial HD. The abuse wild shape - bears are pretty standard, and of course there's always dinos. The high Str and Con mod of the troll makes the animal's physical stats really nice, even if you end up using the lower numbers on the elite array.

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PostPosted: Tue Nov 19, 2013 12:25 pm 
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This is a link to the 3.0 Monster Advancement Rules from the SRD. (Here is the root page). I'll note that monsters can be advanced versions of themselves, as well; character levels aren't the only option (An aberration, for instance, can be a stronger version of an aberration).

Important Points:
A monster with class levels has a CR equal to its old CR plus the number of any class levels it has, regardless of synergy (unlike 3.5).
A monster with class levels has a character level equal to its old number of Hit Dice plus the number of class levels it has.

I'll also point out that MM2 added ECL, but I am not sure if any of the MM1 monsters were ever retroactively given ECL adjustments. ECL is simply an additional value some monsters have that gets added to the second "Important Point" above when determining a monster's total character level. It does not add to the CR.

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PostPosted: Tue Nov 19, 2013 12:27 pm 
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So, to use a troll from a previous post, which has a CR of 5, I want to make it a CR of 10. So does that mean just adding 5 character class levels, as in a simple base CR + levels, or does it get more convoluted than that?

And to answer your question for 3.0 (not 3.5), that's correct, it doesn't get more complicated than that. New CR = Old CR + Levels. It doesn't matter what class the monster takes a level in.

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PostPosted: Tue Nov 19, 2013 1:20 pm 
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Excellent. Thanks for digging up the 3.0 SRD. Zombler was one of the ones I tried, but is unfortunately blocked. Stupid firewalls...

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PostPosted: Tue Nov 19, 2013 1:22 pm 
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 21, 2013 4:12 pm 
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Says the guy with writing coming out of his avatar's head. Virtual indeed...

Thanks, guys. That helped.

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http://www.opengamingfoundation.org/srd.html (3.0 SRD)
http://www.d20srd.org/ (3.5 SRD)


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