pls mega, you want golgari evolpea with elf splash play my deck not anything barney cooks up

for the record barney I also run deadbridge shamen cause it trades up, it's an elf and it's a good sacrifice target too

Thanks for trying my suggestions, coexist

This is what the list looks like as of now. The splash of Empath and the second evoleap have been doing work

3 x Thornbow Archer
2 x Bone Splinters
3 x Dwynen's Elite
4 x Elvish Visionary
2 x Evolutionary Leap
3 x Reave Soul
2 x Deadbridge Shaman
1 x Nissa, Vastwood Seer
3 x Jagged-Scar Archers
1 x Reclamation Sage
3 x Shaman of the Pack
2 x Dwynen, Gilt-Leaf Daen
4 x Lys Alana Huntmaster
1 x Llanowar Empath
2 x Gilt-Leaf Winnower
1 x Woodland Bellower


7 x Swamp
10 x Forest
2 x Woodland Cemetary
4 x Golgari Guildgate

Looks strong.

Still nine cards I hate but I just can't think right now what I would sub them for, I'd have to think about it. Knowing that you actually field test my suggestions makes me want to spend the time trying to optimize that deck...

Lemme guess:

2x Deadbridge Shaman
3x Shaman of the Pack
1x Woodland Bellower
1x Reclamation Sage
2x Gilt Leaf Winnower

The only one of those I find even remotely debatable is Deadbridge Shaman.. but what would you put in that's better? If you don't like Shaman of the Pack in these Elf decks, I don't even know if your head is screwed on straight.

ya what nine cards barney? other than deathbridge of course

One thing that i'm having trouble with seems to be the manabase. Idk if my land count is too low because sometimes it gets difficult to play on curve since the deck has a lot of 3 and 4 drops

Not the shamans obviously that's a major win con that's synergistic. It's those one drop archers

as of now i'm happy with the creatures for the most part. If i have the mana to play them and curve out decently I win every time. Just unsure of the manabase

I would only remove the archers because his mana base doesn't support them only 7 sources untapped on turn 1 in the deck. that's what like a 15% chance to play them if you get them turn 1?

don't feel like doing the actual math atm

I'll fix the mana base and give some other suggestions, gimme a sec

Should ideally be 13 S. It's close enough IMO. But I could still see dropping archers for a better 2/3 drop. You can't lose any Forests, it's already -2 of where it should be.

What other 2-3 drops are good besides the ones he's running? I hate those 1/1s.

I dunno, maybe eyeblight assassins? This meta is pretty lean.

If i'm cutting archers its going to be to add more lands mainly. Unless the manabase will be fine after the cuts

One of the reasons i liked the archers is because they help fill out the manacurve, and if you do get to play it on turn 1 its a 2/2 for 1

Ok, here goes my suggestions. Let's start with the mana base:

-2 swamp
-3 forest
+3 Foundry of the Consuls (this helps what the deck is trying to do, and you'll see we need more sac targets)
+1 Rogue's Passage (this is an important win con with your Jagged Scars
+4 Evolving Wilds (we're going to destroy your ability to make a T1 drop so these become good to ensure we have our 2nd forest by T3)

You'll notice I added THREE land there. Because of the 4 colourless land, that's important.

ok here comes the rest of what I think you should do. We're going to try and get you much faster wins here. We need to outrace Languish and have more ability to come back from one by having a lower curve to get stuff out fast. Think Tuskin Raiders or something. Let's be honest, elves are not a Tier 1 deck, but by going this route I think we're getting it as close as we can to almost getting there...

- 3x Thornbow Archer (awful, t1 is for taplands or evolving wilds)
+2x Bone Splinters
+1x Reave Soul
- 2x Deadbridge Shaman
+3x Fleshbag Marauder (with the Bone Splinters and additional Reave Soul, we have more control so we can run these. Beast says that this makes me a hypocrite because I'm always pushing synergy with Elves, but don't see these as Creatures. These are removal spells)
- 1x Reclamation Sage (this guy is an overcosted nightmare, he is ONLY playable with Bellower which we're taking out)
- 2x Gilt-Leaf Winnower (in a deck like this, you can't play stuff that you're tempted to hang onto. And this is way too expensive. We can do better stuff with 5 mana and we have enough removal now)
- 1x Woodland Bellower (I strongly believe this dude has no place in an Elf deck. He's a control guy)

There we go baby. This is as close as I think elves can get to being competitive, and it still doesn't make them tier 1. Give it a spin if you want. Try 3 matches at least. It's faster and you're trying to kill sooner before your opponent finds solutions.

I should mention this makes the deck harder to play correctly. You will have way more decision points in a match. But a good player does well with a broader toolkit so I think you'll appreciate your additional options now. Go get em!

edit: I added two more land in this version

First off, I usually run the archers. Now that that's out of the way, let me explain the logic:

With only seven swamps you've still got an 86% chance of having a swamp if you have an archer in your opening hand. Now that's a bit low, but it's not a huge problem. You could justify running a later drop though, because then you don't mind playing a tapland first turn. Personally, given the lack of obviously better 2/3 drops, I still run the archers, in my version.

For elves to win, you don't need a 1 drop (we're not playing mono red or white weenies), we need to set up the engine consistent. I HAVE to be able to play Jagged Scar on t3, followed up with a t4 huntmaster/Lord, and then let's explode the board on t5 by NOT playing a 5-drop.

t1 tapland
t2 visionary or Leap or maybe Elite if stuck
t3 Jagged Scar
t4 Huntmaster
t5 if you need removal now, you can Huntmaster/Bonesplinters or Elite/Visionary with a Fleshbag... otherwise, let's get this party started with Jagged and Elite or Visionary.

t5 can see Shaman depending on clock.

that's what the deck needs to do.

barney you didn't add enough cards i'm at 58 cards when i try to build it unless im missing something

I wanna go archer, dwynen... I like having some cheap plays so that I can try to always use 100% of my mana. I'll post my build in a bit for comparison.

I don't like Dwynen in a deck with no chance of getting his upside on curve.