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PostPosted: Mon Aug 17, 2015 11:11 pm 
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Ocelot the first list I theorycrafted for Origins was an izzet deck that aimed to be somewhere between control and aggro. While I think you can make an aggro deck with control elements or a control deck with a fast clock, I think it is important to have a consistent strategy and stick to it.

Izzet will never be as fast as mono W or mono R aggro, so you do have to play control in certain matchups. But twinbolt is just devastating to decks that rely on a lot of 1 toughness creatures. The answer to this sort of matchup is to play differently rather than include a ton of defensive cards like arsonist and perilous myrs.

Izzet isn't built for the late game. You don't have enchantment removal to deal with things like Evolutionary Leap, Thopter Spy Network, Sphinx's Tutelage etc. Some of the cards you run do not have much value until the late game, like ravaging blaze and inspiration.

On the other hand, if you do want to go for more of a control route you need more finishers. The planeswalkers are decent but you could also throw in a few more cards. Disciple of the Ring would be very good here, I opted for Soulblade Djinn because I like the evasion and team pump. Mage ring bullies are not great in a slower build IMO.

I just posted my list so I won't go into more detail about individual card choices. I do think this is a fun archetype to play with.


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PostPosted: Tue Aug 18, 2015 12:41 am 
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So the majority of decks I've seen in Izzet are thopter-based, and I wanted to try and bring back the version that used burn and blue control. So this is my attempt at Dodge & Burn, though I built it with a 2HG focus, instead of the usual 1v1.

Dodge and Burn

Lands

Island x 9
Mountain x 9
Sulfur Falls x 2
Izzet Guildgate x 4

1-mana

Fiery Impulse x4

2-mana

Perilous Myr x 3
Jace, Vryn's Prodigy
Telling Time x 2
Disperse x 4
Ravaging Blaze x 2
Twin Bolt x 4
Displacement Wave x 2

3-mana

Chandra, Fire of Kaladesh
Calculated Dismissal x 3
Anchor to the Æther x 3
Exquisite Firecraft x 2

4-mana

Inspiration x 2

5-mana

Disciple of the Ring
Embermaw Hellion x 2

I'm not sure how well people here like 2HG, but it's my favorite mode, and I usually end up playing the support to my more aggressive friends. The only creatures in my deck need to provide some useful benefit other than attacking to be put in, was my thinking. Basically, as long as I can remove threats, control the tempo, and buy my partner time to get his/her game winners out, I've done my job.

I'm open to suggestions and constructive criticism.


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PostPosted: Fri Aug 21, 2015 1:32 pm 
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Izzet Control
1 drops:
4 Fiery Impulse

2 drops:
3 Sigiled Starfish
2 Abbot of Keral Keep
3 Telling Time
4 Twin Bolt

3 drops:
3 Jhessian Thief
1 Chandra, Fire of Kaladesh
3 Calculated Dismissal
2 Exquisite Firecraft

4 drops:
2 Bone to Ash

5 drops:
1 Disciple of the Ring
2 Soulblade Djinn
2 Embermaw Hellion
2 Chandra's Ignition

X drops:
3 Ravaging Blaze

Mana:
8 Island
9 Mountain
2 Sulfer Falls
1 Izzet Guildgate
4 Evolving Wilds

10 1 or 2 drop red spells make it doable to flip chandra on turn 4. Also sigiled starfish is very important to this deck's strategy and a lot of people dont want to spend mana killing a 0 power guy. Chandra's ignition is a huge blowout once you get one of your finishers to stick, and the rest of the deck is meant to stall out your opponent until that happens.


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PostPosted: Mon Aug 24, 2015 3:23 am 
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Want to post my Prowessdeck because it's a lot of fun to play. It has high damagespikes, but i don't think it can be competitive, as it has some difficulties when faced against removals.

Prowess-Aggro

4 x Mage-Ring Bully
2 x Abbot of Keral Keep
3 x Jhessian Thief
2 x Soulblade Djinn
1 x Chandra, Fire of Kaladesh

3 x Fiery Impulse
3 x Titan's Strength
3 x Dragon Fodder
3 x Infectious Bloodlust
3 x Twin Bolt
1 x Act of Treason
1 x Exquisite Firecraft
2 x Disperse
4 x Telling Time
3 x Inspiration

4 x Izzet Guildgate
2 x Foundry of the Consuls
1 x Rogue's Passage
2 x Sulfur Falls
8 x Mountain
5 x Island


In the sideboard you find some card's i want to try out for this deck:
1 x Talent of the Telepath
2 x Anchor to the Æther
1 x Avaricious Dragon
1 x Jace, Vryn's Prodigy
1 x Disciple of the Ring
2 x Ravaging Blaze
1 x Displacement Wave
1 x Chandra's Ignition


You try to get out some cards with prowess and buff them up, while killing enemies defense via direct damage. It's start isn't amazingly fast, but that's also true for the whole format, so it's kind of ok. This deck can establish high amounts of damage, but is vulnerable if enemy kills your few prowess-creatures. So its your job to keep them alive, thats especially true for Mage-Ring Bully because he always attacks.
I am kind of sad, that i didn't find a spot for a 1-drop.
Dragon Fodder summon two creatures to block or get in some extra damage and trigger prowess
Infectious Bloodlust this on a Mage-Ring-Bully converts him instantly into a 5/4 this turn. There is no downside, as bully attacks each turn by himself and if the creature dies, you get some extra spell to cast in your hand. Haste is also useful.
I am curious how you would design this style of deck.

Edit: This deck is kind of the same as the "Flash Bang" deck on page 7


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PostPosted: Mon Aug 24, 2015 4:32 am 
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I like anchor to the aether in this deck more then firecraft (I'd cut the foundries for islands if you do that though) the card is almost pure tempo it helps if you sort of read it as "return target creature to oppenents hand, the next time they would draw they don't. Scry 1" so good in tempo decks with :u:


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PostPosted: Tue Aug 25, 2015 5:36 pm 
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I've updated my Thopter list foundhere. I've added more red cards plus I've gone to 25 land because the Esperzoa tax is real and cracking Foundry costs :6:. This deck doesn't want to miss land drops.

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PostPosted: Wed Aug 26, 2015 1:50 am 
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Jolly wrote:
Want to post my Prowessdeck because it's a lot of fun to play. It has high damagespikes, but i don't think it can be competitive, as it has some difficulties when faced against removals.

Prowess-Aggro

4 x Mage-Ring Bully
2 x Abbot of Keral Keep
3 x Jhessian Thief
2 x Soulblade Djinn
1 x Chandra, Fire of Kaladesh

3 x Fiery Impulse
3 x Titan's Strength
3 x Dragon Fodder
3 x Infectious Bloodlust
3 x Twin Bolt
1 x Act of Treason
1 x Exquisite Firecraft
2 x Disperse
4 x Telling Time
3 x Inspiration

4 x Izzet Guildgate
2 x Foundry of the Consuls
1 x Rogue's Passage
2 x Sulfur Falls
8 x Mountain
5 x Island


In the sideboard you find some card's i want to try out for this deck:
1 x Talent of the Telepath
2 x Anchor to the Æther
1 x Avaricious Dragon
1 x Jace, Vryn's Prodigy
1 x Disciple of the Ring
2 x Ravaging Blaze
1 x Displacement Wave
1 x Chandra's Ignition


You try to get out some cards with prowess and buff them up, while killing enemies defense via direct damage. It's start isn't amazingly fast, but that's also true for the whole format, so it's kind of ok. This deck can establish high amounts of damage, but is vulnerable if enemy kills your few prowess-creatures. So its your job to keep them alive, thats especially true for Mage-Ring Bully because he always attacks.
I am kind of sad, that i didn't find a spot for a 1-drop.
Dragon Fodder summon two creatures to block or get in some extra damage and trigger prowess
Infectious Bloodlust this on a Mage-Ring-Bully converts him instantly into a 5/4 this turn. There is no downside, as bully attacks each turn by himself and if the creature dies, you get some extra spell to cast in your hand. Haste is also useful.
I am curious how you would design this style of deck.

Edit: This deck is kind of the same as the "Flash Bang" deck on page 7

I made a prowess deck myself with the same creature base. It's fun, but unfortunately not consistent. If you don't draw your few prowess creatures, you're dead. If they get removed, dead. I don't mean this in a "dies to removal" kind of way - I mean 1 spell destroys 10% of your creature base. And although these creatures are powerful, you can't wait 4 turns to finally draw a 2-drop and expect it to take over the game.


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PostPosted: Wed Aug 26, 2015 2:11 am 
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yes, thats unfortunately true. You need to go Aggro and dont let them die. If you can manage this, its a win. But its too easy for the opponent to counter it. But its kind of fun to play and i use it sometimes to grind the ki.


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 04, 2015 9:15 am 
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Here's another Izzet Prowess deck.

I really, really like this one. It's been the most successful deck I've come up with so far in Duels Origins (13-1 with it, on Steam, most opponents rank 30-40).

Two Drops

4 Mage-Ring Bully
3 Sigiled Starfish
2 Abbot of Keral Keep
1 Jace, Vryn's Prodigy

Three Drops

3 Jhessian Thief
1 Chandra, Fire of Kaladesh

Four Drops

3 Tower Geist

Five Drops

2 Soulblade Djinn
2 Embermaw Hellion
1 Disciple of the Ring

Spells

4 Twin Bolt
3 Telling Time
3 Ravaging Blaze
2 Exquisite Firecraft
2 Chandra's Ignition

Land

4 Izzet Guildgate
2 Sulfur Falls
9 Island
9 Mountain

I was quite surprised by how versatile and resilient this deck has been. It's got quite a lot of card selection, and can usually find the cards it needs by the time it needs them. Chandra's Ignition and Disciple of the Ring are the two stars of the deck, but every card in there has performed really well. I did lose one game to a questionable keep (three lands, all mountains) followed by a bad draw (next three lands were also mountains), but it's been a lot of fun to play and very consistent. It matches up particularly well against RDW and Izzet Thopters, which was actually what I designed the deck to do well against, as I've run into a ton of those recently. It's less hot against green in general and golgari control in particular, but overall, I think it's pretty darn solid. So far at least.

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 04, 2015 2:02 pm 
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randomname wrote:
Here's another Izzet Prowess deck.

I really, really like this one. It's been the most successful deck I've come up with so far in Duels Origins (13-1 with it, on Steam, most opponents rank 30-40).

I tried to build a prowess deck, too, but ran into the inconsistency problems other people wrote about. I'll try your build and see how it goes.


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 04, 2015 2:14 pm 
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randomname wrote:
Here's another Izzet Prowess deck.

I really, really like this one. It's been the most successful deck I've come up with so far in Duels Origins (13-1 with it, on Steam, most opponents rank 30-40).

I tried to build a prowess deck, too, but ran into the inconsistency problems other people wrote about. I'll try your build and see how it goes.


I hope it works well for you. Please let me know how it goes!

Oh, one thing: IMHO it's a good idea to play turn two scryfish if you don't have a third land over one of the aggressive 2 drops, unless there's compelling reason to do other-wise. This deck wants to scry for land early, scry away from land later.

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 04, 2015 4:28 pm 
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Why the tower geists?


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 04, 2015 5:47 pm 
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Without having played the deck, I think the Geists fit the theme pretty well. They're no prowess creatures, but they are evasive (which is good for Djinn buffs) and they draw/filter cards to get you spells to work with. These spell heavy decks spend a lot of cards and it's always a good idea to add some compensation. They also fill the 4-cmc-spot - the only competitors here are Whirler Rogues to clear the path for prowess creatures. I would probably try to replace the Hellions with Whirler Rogues to lower the curve, to have an immediate effect and more synergy with the Djinn. There are too many 5-drops for my taste.


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 04, 2015 7:13 pm 
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Gegliosch explained exactly why the Geists are in there - though often, I'm using them to find my fifth land, and I also wanted enough toughness>=2 fliers to mess up Thopter decks (and five does seem to be enough so far). They also put a card into the graveyard and commonly draw removal, making them a great lead card to follow with Jace (or Chandra, though she doesn't care if there are cards in the graveyard or not). They even the deck out and make it more consistent. Also, they cost 1 blue and 3 colorless mana, which is a nice advantage over Whirler Rogue.

I certainly understand wanting to fit Whirler Rogue into the deck. It's one of the best blue value cards, and it does have some synergy with a few other things we've got going (Jhessian Thief and Djinn most prominently). But I really don't want to lose any of the five drops I've got. The Hellions do a lot of useful things. They're the only creature in there that survives languish. We've got every red spell that can hit the opponent, and it pumps all of those. Half of our other creatures are red, and it buffs those too. Chandra's Ignition on an Abbot or Bully with a Hellion down wipes everything four toughness or lower and leaves you with two creatures rather than one (I've won more than one game that way). It can block stuff safely that nothing else in the deck can. It's the only trampler. You can kill serious threats like Outland Colossus with Ravaging Blaze a turn faster. Just really handy to have. I think, on the whole, for this deck it's better than Whirler Rogue. But I could very, very easily be wrong on that.

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 04, 2015 7:15 pm 
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randomname wrote:
Please let me know how it goes!

I won 1 game and lost another 1. Then I wanted to change deck and after a long losing streak I rage quitted. :sweat: Of course that has nothing to do with your deck, my result with it is still 1-1, I wrote this as an end to the story. ;)


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PostPosted: Mon Sep 07, 2015 6:46 pm 
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Last edited by DaRkStAr on Mon Dec 14, 2015 9:13 pm, edited 3 times in total.

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PostPosted: Mon Sep 07, 2015 6:51 pm 
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no esperzoa?


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PostPosted: Mon Sep 07, 2015 7:01 pm 
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I saw a similiar deck on Nighthawks Stream and it is fun against AI, but for me it is not working as good in Versus Battles.

UR Conjuring Artifact [Origins]

4 x Fiery Impuls
4 x Perilous Myr
3 x Runed Servitor
4 x Alchemist's Vial
3 x Chief of the Foundry
3 x Thopter Engineer
3 x Ghirapur Gearcrafter
4 x Artificer's Epiphany
3 x Whirler Rogue
2 x Pia and Kiran Nalaar
3 x Reclusive Artificer
2 x Thopter Spy Network
2 x Flameshadow Conjuring

7 x Island
9 x Mountain
2 x Sulfur Falls
1 x Foundry of the Consuls
4 x Izzet Guildgate

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Last edited by DaRkStAr on Mon Dec 14, 2015 9:13 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Tue Sep 08, 2015 7:28 pm 
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Reiku wrote:
So the majority of decks I've seen in Izzet are thopter-based, and I wanted to try and bring back the version that used burn and blue control. So this is my attempt at Dodge & Burn, though I built it with a 2HG focus, instead of the usual 1v1.

Dodge and Burn

Lands

Island x 9
Mountain x 9
Sulfur Falls x 2
Izzet Guildgate x 4

1-mana

Fiery Impulse x4

2-mana

Perilous Myr x 3
Jace, Vryn's Prodigy
Telling Time x 2
Disperse x 4
Ravaging Blaze x 2
Twin Bolt x 4
Displacement Wave x 2

3-mana

Chandra, Fire of Kaladesh
Calculated Dismissal x 3
Anchor to the Æther x 3
Exquisite Firecraft x 2

4-mana

Inspiration x 2

5-mana

Disciple of the Ring
Embermaw Hellion x 2

I'm not sure how well people here like 2HG, but it's my favorite mode, and I usually end up playing the support to my more aggressive friends. The only creatures in my deck need to provide some useful benefit other than attacking to be put in, was my thinking. Basically, as long as I can remove threats, control the tempo, and buy my partner time to get his/her game winners out, I've done my job.

I'm open to suggestions and constructive criticism.


Looks good. Can I suggest removing the 3 copies of Calculated Dismissal?They are situational at best,since you are playing tempo.... I have a similar build that plays Harbinger of the Tides that bounces their biggest threat. Perhaps do away with 1 copy of Displacement Wave and fit in an evasive enabler like Whirler Rogue?

(- 3x Calculated Dismissal,- 1x Displacement Wave,+ 2 Harbinger of the Tides,+2 Whirler Rogue)

Hope you consider trying out the tweak.All the best


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 09, 2015 6:09 am 
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So I reworked my izzet control deck, and did away with the 5 counterspells, because they aren't very good with Prowess, I also took out all 3 telling times for the Vial/Epiphany draw combo. Anyway, any feedback is always welcome.

1 drops:
4 Fiery Impulse

2 drops:
3 Sigiled Starfish
2 Abbot of Keral Keep
4 Alchemist's Vial
4 Twin Bolt

3 drops:
3 Jhessian Thief
1 Chandra, Fire of Kaladesh
4 Artificer's Epiphany
2 Exquisite Firecraft

5 drops
1 Disciple of the Ring
2 Soulblade Djinn
2 Embermaw Hellion
2 Chandra's Ignition

X drops:
3 Ravaging Blaze

Lands:
7 Island
9 Mountain
2 Sulfer Falls
2 Izzet Guildgate
4 Evolving Wilds


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