Fear not the triple post. That's how I plan to get my post count into the top ten again.
I can't believe I let myself fall so far.

@Rubik: How do you know what card numbers originally had?
You know what card everybody "has", or what card everybody started with? (or both)?

and what PK said

I just realized Rag isn't in this game.

The Day One Lynch is going to actually be like work.

I thought this process had been in reverse (ie I thought he had the knowing card, and lost it), which would mean that he would have information he couldn't have had based on his other statements.

It was a misreading on my part.

@Storyteller:

Why not assume it hit everyone? Besides, I'm not saying reveal the abilities of the role you had. I'm saying reveal the card you were. Aside from everyone guessing what card every card can do (as the person who has Rubik's card is able to do), can you give me an actual downside to this potential increase in information for us as town?

Just as long as your half page of being critical doesn't violate rules #1, 2, and 10 of the game, then we won't have a problem.

Everyone had the freedom to choose whatever card they wanted. In their infinite wisdom, someone chose a card that would result in absolute chaos and rob everyone else of their choices. I may have personally felt that including such a card in the game was a bad play, but the choices of what cards to include was not in my hands, it was in all of yours, and I wasn't about to take away that freedom just because once choice was going to impact the game in such a way.

Further criticism of game design can be hashed out to your heart's content after the game is completed. I'll be happy to argue about it with you, if you like. But doing so now may potentially become a vehicle for negatively impacting the natural enjoyment of the game. So let's curb such conversations, at least for now, okay?

Oh, if it's just the role names, it's no problem.
It's just that certain someone started revealing abilities (not sure if joke?) and I didn't like that.

to be fair you didn't have to make it do the literal most obvious thing. I was sort of assuming you wouldn't, or I probably would have picked something else.

fair enough.

If you're referring to me: You don't have to go as far as I did, I chose to. But having a general basis to go on is important. Right now, there are two people that have the list of every card in the game. No one knows whether those two players are mafia, or one or the other, or both town. Ideally, both of them are town, but in the case that a mafiate knows, I think it's best if everyone knows.

I'm not against revealing what the roles did as well, but I'm not expecting everyone to be like that; and I'm not going to hold it against anyone to not reveal that information. But I will think twice about people who do not want to reveal their old card.

If having a strong negative opinion violates #1, 2, or 10 as you see it, then me and you do not really agree about mafia very much. Which is fine - this is your community, not mine, I am a stranger here, it's your customs/rules/ways of playing that I can choose to adapt or not, not the other way around. Life goes on whether I like something or not, as it always does.

Frankly, I signed up for this game because I assumed it would be a mafia game based around being balanced, not about freedom - the sign up thread I volunteered for didn't mention anything about total freedom, but it did mention a disclaimer for when picking cards that you'd have to keep things balanced. I don't try to join games that I think I won't enjoy just to complain. My original, basic complaint was that this has been a vehicle for sharply "negatively impacting the natural enjoyment of the game" for myself. I feel part of getting to the point where I can ignore that feeling and move to enjoying the game is to mention my dissatisfaction, discuss it briefly, and move on. I felt like I had somewhat done that until your post, which has made me want to revisit it again.

If you think I am too toxic, or inappropriate, I am more than happy to replace out and go do something else - I don't want to ruin your game, or your community, and I really don't have personal animosity. If I've signed up for the wrong kind of game, then I apologize for wasting everyone else's time, really.

@PK:

Do you have a problem continuing playing the game despite what has happened? If so, then you should consider removing yourself from here if it bothers you that much.

I found the mechanic disappointing. I decided to complain about it. I am more bothered by the reaction to my complaint than the thing I complained about at this point. I think that's a fair summary of events.

And I've already mentioned what you've written, so I'm not sure why you've decided to repeat it. Really, I'm not sure what the point of your post is at all.

The point is that if you're so bothered by it, rather than leaving it up to the mod to remove you you can remove yourself if you're that bothered.

Other than that, all you are doing is not dropping it and continuing the game as is which has led to a side conversation/distraction that doesn't help the game (in fact has no bearing on the game).

If you're going to do that, you should remove yourself rather than be a problem.

If one side would just stop talking about it it would be over. PK has said his piece and was willing to move on, but your continued responses to the matter has prolonged the issue.

Just everyone stop talking about it and play the game.

Fair enough.

So, our current Day One Agenda:
Old Card Claiming
Razor Alignment
Storyteller Alignment

==xx==

Claiming old cards gathers information publicly, lets those of us who do not have that information have it to work with (both good and bad), and gives us a clue (very loosely) what the abilities could be.

--xx--

Razor made a big choice, with a big consequence claiming that the best time was now, rather than later, or never.

--xx--

Storyteller let slip that he hopes his ability isn't currently in "mafia" hands.

==xx==

Personally, the one giving the most trouble analyzing is Storyteller's wording. Sure it could be subconsiously stating a fact; or it could be deliberate mafia ploy.

I personally, will need more time to think about it. BUt I figured I'd collect all possible discussion pieces in one place.

Other facts to note: With 13 players now, we have 4 mafia to hunt, and we need 7 to lynch. We have about 6.5 days if I translated timing appropriately. And nobody seems to have cast a serious vote besides PK (sorry that part is my opinion).

Well, I did come here with intention to confirm, but jesus, what?

If it makes anyone feel any better, as far as I can tell there aren't any cards that care about color.

There are, however, cards that might potentially distinguish between creatures and non-creatures (if there is such a distinction for abilities).

---

Elijin, I need you to tell me how powerful your starting card was without revealing your ability or card name.

After thinking about what KoD said, I'm just going to /out, this is a complete disaster in terms of raising hostility - the recent exchanges have pushed me from annoyed to suddenly legitimately angry and now I'm fuming at my desk annoyed. This just isn't a good match for how I feel about mafia, how I want to play the game, and getting into escalated arguments with a player and the mod is just bad for the game. I'm sure it ruins everyone else's enjoyment of the game as well.

Have fun, I apologize for your inconvenience, and will no longer intrude on any of your future games. And I mean that with zero passive aggressiveness, I apologize for disrupting your mafia "ecosystem." I hope everyone else enjoys the game.