You read my mind.. sorta

I play it in Naya mid range bc of Thoctar, and Selesnya/Naya auras decks. It's a helluva lot better than any draw offered by white. I propose two copies bc that's all you need. I prefer it over Packleader in Naya bc I'd rather play Baneslayer, Stormbreath/Arbor when I get to 5 mana instead of a 4/4 who never attacks.

While I can see your argument mega, green's draw is really situational and the only "draw" I am really in favor of ultimately is the visionary. And if built around, the beasts are decent enough because it comes attached to an ok body but it's unfortunate that it isn't available till 5 mana.

I have tested ferocity a ton and it has always just been way to situational for my tastes here. Once in a while it is awesome, but generally if I really look at it, I am doing well anyway if it's working.

The issue I have with enlarge is that if you're two for one'd, you just tapped out and are much less likely to be able to cast anything else.

2bestest:

We can't build our decks in fear of being two-for-oned though. If that's the case then every pump spell and aura is a bad card unless you're putting it on Primal Huntbeast.

Look.. we are smart players here (except Barney ) we know the cards.. we know what our opponents can do. Up against red with one open mana.. don't pump anything that dies to shock. Up against blue.. don't pump anything unless they're tapped out or you have a pretty good idea what's in their hand. Up against white, play around Reprisal.. up against black, plan for Ulcerate or Flesh to Dust. It's not that big of a threat IMO.. unless you're dumb enough to play into it.

bah!

This deck NEEDS to have an early play or there are hands that just don't start until T4 or T5 (if you don't hit a visionary or cultivate, you're in trouble - especially on the draw). Satyr fits the shell and seems like it's a necessary evil. Man I wish we had something like Sylvan Ranger or Sakura-Tribe Elder in our pool.

Hydra and Hoof are fun but the deck is fine without them too (especially with all the draw opportunities).

Admirer is more draw and just helps get deeper into the deck. I've cut 1 Satyr and 1 Disciple to squeeze them in and will test this for a bit.

elk

As you said and from my experience too, sometimes you have nothing to do till T4-T5, I wouldn't begin testing cutting the satyr. If I was testing that change I would start -2 disciples +2 admirers.

Any additional feedback?

Would you be looking to fit in Craterhoof, Enlarge or Hydra?

elk

Late game isn't my concern here, I am not worried about fitting in more late threats..

I would want to figure out how to add more consistency to the early game. Give me some more time to get back to you on how I feel we could do so.

The deck was meant to stall through the first few turns with Visionary, Wayfinder, Disciple and Fountain while hopefully getting lucky with a Cultivate. 8 possible chump blockers and then the miniscule life gain was usually enough to get to a stabilizing game. Wayfinders and Fountains obviously got worse as the game went on but the deck typically could draw enough that it didn't matter much.

In fact I was quite happy with the deck pre-DLC but with many folks updating their decks and of course getting hoofed in a game, it had me wonder if there was potential to improve. I'd love to have better options on the low end that don't diminish as much in the late game but there aren't a lot of great fits in this ramp.draw shell.

Admirer is fine and I'd like to keep it but Disciple does really factor into the deck seeing mid/late games. If I use the 'would I rather' hand evaluation method, I typically wanted the Disciple for stabilizing and the Admirer for late game digging. Since this deck needs to stabilize more than draw, I think the Disciples will stay as is.

I'd love to keep the Hydra/ Hoof idea for the fun factor but it doesn't seem to be necessary. I can probably just remove the Stomper(s) to slot them in for when I want to live the dream.


@Mega - I spun the Enlarge as you suggested but it did really turn out to be an overpriced Primal Bellow in most cases. I did force someone to cough up a Baneslayer to a Wayfinder though so that was awesome (promptly followed by a scoop/quit which made it even better).


elk

That's awesome though! Did you ever hit an Enlarge AND a Primal Bellow on the same creature? The damage is just stupid.

ugh I'm gonna do it. I'm going to swap Satyr Wayfinder for Elvish Pioneer and test for a while. I know..... I know.....I know....alright already...I know. It's still ramp regardless....I know....I get it.... stahp!

Actually considering the early game, it may be worth while to include Wayfinder and Pioneer which would give me ample mana ramp/tempo and chump options. It just doesn't seem right shifting the curve that much.

elk

Unless you drop the visionary.

I would play Young Wolf over Wayfinder in this pile if you feel you need more drops in the 1-2CMC range. Another option is adding an Ingot or two to more consistently hit five mana on turn four.

Young Wolf is a good call. That card is really obnoxious.

Here is where I'm at with it.



I'm still not understanding the Enlarge hate. It just wins.. over and over again for me. I put in 10 games and it was instrumental in winning in 6 of them. One match I was getting destroyed by a turn 2 Truefire Paladin (on the play), turn 3 Ordeal of Heliod swing for 3, turn 4 swing and pump for a million, T5 Nimbus Wings swing for a ton.. bringing me down to one life. My play was T1 land, T2 land Elvish Visionary, T3 land (no cultivate), T4 land Masked Admirers.. and T5 land, Enlarge on Masked Admirers smashing the stupid Truefire Paladin. I was able to turn the game around solely bc of Enlarge. I won the game 3 turns later with T6 Arbor Colossus, (which he used Act of Treason on forcing me to chump) T7 Enlarge+Primal Bellow on Arbor Colossus for 20. These decks need this effect. Primal Bellow is awesome.. and basically.. I want more of them. Enlarge fills that need IMO. The removal is just butter. The synergy with Prey Upon is glorious. Giving Arbor Colossus trample is very, very key IMO. For some reason.. that guy is always in my hand. I rarely see Terra Stomper for some reason.. but AC is in my opening grip 75% of the time it feels like.

Craterhoof saved the day vs Spiders (again).

Young Wolf is the anti-aggro card this deck really needs. It's awesome vs white weenies, goblins.. and their bastard hybrid Boros Tokens. T1 Elite Vanguard? Zero F's given

Yeah.. more Enlarge love stories.

It's turn 7 or 8 vs White Weenies. Opponent has an imposing board consisting of two freshly convoked Triplicate Spirits a few other weenies, a Paragon and a Baneslayer with summoning sickness. I have an Elvish Visionary, a 2/2 Young Wolf, a Masked Admirers and a 9/9 Arbor Colossus I just monsterfied to blow up a token. He has somewhere around 7-8 untapped creatures and 5 tapped from Convoking.. and 13 life. He's tapped out.

I cast Enlarge on Arbor Colossus followed up by two Primal Bellows to make him a 32/32.. swing in for the win. I lose that game without Enlarge.. just like I would have lost the game vs Boros Auras. I'm gonna keep updating this post.

Edit: I don't anymore exhilarating tales.. but I played about 20 matches and lost 3.. two to land screw, 1 to an aggressive mono red deck who spammed tokens and had burn to finish me after I stabilized. Enlarge was instrumental all night long. The removal was relevant 90% of the time. The combo with Primal Bellow is an EXCELLENT finisher.. and if they try to gang block an Enlarged creature.. Primal Bellow blows them out hard.

My first attempt to an Elf deck: what do you guys think?
Please be kind, I suck at deckbuilding!

I think you should take up Hearthstone

Sigh... so much for the kindness

Nylea's Disciple is a nice touch to the elf theme. Kind of a wanna be Wellwisher.

Elvish Pioneer is just a tough card. You empty you hand too quick with it and therefore give your opponent too much information. Unfortunately Elvish Visionary and Masked Admirers are not enough card advantage to recoup from what Pioneer ends up doing. Having said that, it can just be another 1/1 body if you don't always use it's ability.

How often do you get to the 8 mana to play Craterhoof Behemoth? Legacy elves have Natural Order to cheat this card into play but here you've got to wait. I would keep track at how often it actually gets played to see if it's really a worth while include.

I'd also consider 1x Hall of Triumph somewhere for another lord/anthem effect.


elk

Thank you, I thought the same!


So do you think I should replace it? Maybe Young wolf?


Well, for now I have yet to play with this deck, so... zero time. But i thought the same: i wanted to put in some Cultivate for help but I fear it is just unnecessary...
Probably I should just put Hall of Triumph as you suggested.
Thanks.