Lord Luna: Thank you for your time and criticism! Yes, I went with the original meaning of Cthonic, and I might tie that into Vlastimir lore/legends, since it's all from his PoV. New Phyrexia is out as per everyone's suggestions! Typos fix'd as well

Hmmm...your take on Valentyn makes me see Nicol Bolas trying to craft him into a mana battery now....hmmm...

hHanks for pointing out the personality/characterisation flaws - I'm not really sure how to fix that without just turning the dossier into a full blown story though...suggestions?

My knowledge on the colors stems more from Analysis discussion on tropes. As stated, I figured it boils down to:
Red - Passion, freedom, burning.
Blue - Logic, wisdom, time.
Green - Nurture, hunting, untamed.
Black - Sacrifice, pain, death, acceptance.
White - Needs of the Many, protection, healing.

Reading those articles...I'm not really seeing anything that contradicts my assumptions?

Barinellos: Making characters organically is easy for me. If that is what I was doing, I'd write him up first then ask you all for mana cost suggestions But this is an exercise in writing within boundaries (something that, as a freelance writer, I need to be good at) - he is a red, blue, green. His story can be twisted to fit that If you understand where I'm coming from >_<

...oh gods I got four more of these guys to go...

The problem is that a lot of these assumptions are surface details rather than core values.

Blue is about progress and self realization. While logic is a common trait that manifests in those seeking that, blue itself isn't ABOUT logic. As odd as it may seem, it isn't about wisdom either, but knowledge. The distinction is fairly subtle, but GREEN is actually more about wisdom than blue is.

Black is ABSOLUTELY NOT about acceptance. It is about ambition and power. Black is the dead opposite of acceptance, which is a GREEN trait again. Black has sacrifice because black is willing to do absolutely anything to accomplish its goals. Black also isn't about pain and death, but those are more tools to realize Black's goals. So yeah, you were pretty far off with black.

Green is another one where you've focused on the surface so much that you've sort of lost track of the core. Green is about... well, it's about systems and knowing one's place in them. Green is acceptance of the world around you and understanding where you fit into it, which is also where wisdom comes in on green. This is why green overlaps community with white, but unlike white, green DOESN'T nurture. Green is very much in the realm of sink or swim.

Just want to point out, for white, that one of its key traits is Order.

OK, learned somehting new about blue. Where does the casual mind rape and time travel fit into that though? :S

Hang on, wasn't the whole point of Black in the Theros block about acceptance of death and it's inevitability? (Erebos comes to mind here...) Also, how would you write a heroic Black mana character otherwise?

And Green is too busy with survival and defiance to accept things as they are - it doesnt bother with such thoughts since it's busy surviving? And I'd argue that Green could be nurture - it has a lot of ways of making things stronger, and some life gain as well.

(Just trying to show my thought process behind these - the colours ARE a lot more complex than I understand. Than anyone understands I'd say, becuase they're very broad concepts? And please do not take any of this as agrument, but discussion.)

Then since we're discussing misconceptions - how the heck does a regular game of Magic look like lore-wise? How does summoning creatures work? Attuning yourself to land? What's the difference between a battle using "standard" and "EDH"...? Actually, nevermind, those questions are more story related >_<

Then how about making him all five colours and leaving it at that?

I would strongly advise against this. One thing that is important to keep in mind is that all people (real people, that is) have aspects of all five colors. That doesn't, however, mean that everybody IS all five colors. Personally, I tend to look at characters in terms of what their primary motivations are, what their core philosophy is. It will prove VERY difficult to show your readers on a consistent and believable basis that your character draws his motivation more or less equally from all five colors.

Hey, Hydriatus! I read through this and it looks solid, though it could use a little refinement. Valentyn seems like a character that's got potential, but he's stretched a bit thin at the moment. I think his strongest angle is his paranoia/self-preservation. That's something I find interesting and, if played right, could make for some cool stories.

Now, here's the thing about color identities: Don't worry about them.

No, really, just forget about them when making a character. Don't even think about it. Just make a character. You want someone with a sword who can manipulate earth? Sure, do that! Fire mage with a propensity for steam? Done! How about a death mage that ONLY kills plant life? Weird, but ok! And maybe the death mage just HATES forests because he grew up on Zendikar and his family got eaten by native flora or something, and so he has a healthy respect for civilization that is capable of beating back encroaching nature. Maybe he really respects research into various anti-plantlife methods, or maybe he's just fueled with rage.

The thing about this character, is that he could be ANY of the colors, sure - but it's the Black that stands out the most. But you only really come to this conclusion after you see the whole picture.

See, if you try to put your character into a box before the character is even on the page, you're doing yourself - and your character - a disservice. Like you said, writing within a system is important. But to do that, all you have to do is WRITE and then make the system work for you. There aren't many hard and fast rules in Magic, and I'm not really into discussing color philosophy endlessly, but what I can say is that Valentyn Mason? He's Black. Very, very Black. If I had to choose a second color, I'd choose Red, but White also works, like Raven suggested. If you REALLY want all three colors, you could. I think he works like that.

But since his best trait is self-preservation, yeah, definitely Black. So, work towards his strengths!

EDIT: Oh, I'd also like to address this:



There is no 1:1 relation between individual games of Magic and lore. It just doesn't work, it really doesn't. I mean, you can have phyrexians and mirrans fighting on the same side of a battlefield. Like, don't try to make sense of it because it doesn't make sense. Just remember that the lore and the game are divorced from one another. There was this whole custody battle...

Those are surface details.

You're kind of confusing one thing with another here. Erebos wasn't a black god about death. He was a death god colored black. And a heroic black character would be... well, selfishly motivated.
Doing something good because it personally effects them. Toshiro Umezawa is the best example in Magic.

Green isn't about defiance. Red is about defiance.
Green is VERY much about accepting the world as it is. It doesn't have grand plans or ambitions, it is about surviving the world... as it is, not trying to change it. And it still isn't about Nurturing. Just because it is about growth doesn't mean it is about nurturing. It's idea of growth is... well, natural selection. Making things better by letting the weak fall.

gameplay and story segregation. Most just don't translate at all.

Summoning has been left very nebulous for a long long time. But the most recent explanation is here:
http://dougbeyermtg.tumblr.com/post/88125914109

As to how you gain mana bonds:
http://archive.wizards.com/Magic/Magazi ... daily/db22

Terrible idea to be honest. You see, any multifaceted character will have something of all five colors in them because that's just how people work. What you have to decide is what core values drive the person and try to focus in on that.

*scratches head* Well I'm at a complete loss then.

1:1 relation between game and lore always seemed simple to me...though THAT explanation would take up an entire thread of it's own >_<

well, we're here to help in any way you need. Just have to ask.

Yeah, Ruwin makes a good point. We've had people in the past really try to push narratives into a direct correlation with the game, and it rarely works. There is nothing wrong with using the cards, of course. I think we've all done it, some more than others. But the relationship has to be reciprocal. Meaning that in most cases, you can't just play a game, and then write a story that works based off that game. You would need to design your deck (and your opponents' decks) with flavor in mind, or it won't work. Here's an example of a poem I wrote based off a game: Dueling Couplets

Now, this poem is based off a theoretically possible game of Magic. But, it wasn't a real game. It was a staged game, using the cards and the draws I wanted to fit the flavor I was going for. If I just sat down and played a random game with a random deck, against another random deck, I seriously doubt I could make a poem, or a story, that would work. There's just too much of a disconnect.

Raven...challenge accepted I'll schedule a game for this Friday, note it down and work it into Valentyn's story...

Now to get back on topic - guess this is all gonna be trashed now to rework things from the ground up. Hmm, maybe I should make him a five colour - being a black/white mana walker is kinda useless when your go to answer to a problem is to throw a dragon at it...

But there has to be a way to write such a character as more than a Sarkhan wannabe...

I fear you may have missed my point...

But hey, to each their own. Like Barinellos said, we're just trying to help.

I'm going to laugh when someone drops a card from somewhere that hasn't existed in ages. Or a planeswalker, because those are strictly hands off in the MEM.

Dack Fayden summoned dragons as well. Just because it is in the spell wheelhouse, doesn't mean it HAS to be a defining character trait. All that is required is to find some way to make red matter, so look at the shared values red might have with white and black. Red and Black both value individual freedom, so that one is easy.

Raven: Uhm...what was the point then?

Barinellos: How are they off limits? I mean, the characters themselves, yes. Their aspects made up of a character's impressions and memories of them which are what is actually summoned though?

The point I was making is that that process rarely if ever works. It's difficult, and the results are often disjointed and lackluster. Like I said, though, if you want to take it as a "challenge," be my guest. It might work out for you, for all I know.

There is no Czechoslovakia any more. You cannot go to Germany and see the Berlin Wall. Pompei is nothing but ashes. Etc., etc., etc..

As for the "challenge" with involving a random game of Magic into your story, I fear you may be biting off far more than you can chew since, as far as we know, you are a new and untested writer.

I don't have a lot of time for this post, but I want to say that, concerning your views on the color wheel, you're focusing too hard on the mechanics associated with them and not understanding the actual philosophies.

Virtually nothing in the current time period would really allow for your characters, unless they were ancient beings, to encounter said things. Tolaria does not exist anymore, the Ice Age is over, Tarkir presents its own craziness, and all sorts of other things.

As to walkers, no... in the case of walkers, in the game, you aren't summoning copies of them, you're calling the actual being to do a favor for you.

I'm sort of loathe to throw more stuff at you given that I feel like maybe we've kind of collectively overwhelmed you a little, but if you're interested in this there might be a few places I can point you to as good examples of duels in Magic fiction.

The most recent instalment of Sarkhan and Ugin's Excellent Adventure in particular has an awesome duel between Nicol Bolas and Ugin that I honestly think is a good representation of how ancient Planeswalkers fought.

Not to blow my own horn but I'm actually very proud of the duel that happens during the climax of To Call the World to Heel which is... admittedly not a great place to start since it's coming in the middle of several story arcs but honestly if this is something you're into it might be worth looking into anyway? A lot of the spells cast are real cards or are definitely meant to emulate basic effects from the game.

And there is... something else... I want to recommend... but I cannot for the life of me remember what the hell it was Barinellos, I'm almost certain it was one of your stories, actually, that I remarked recently on as having one of the best duels I can remember reading. Aaarrrgh*, what the heck was it?

*Not you, Aaarrrgh, but if you do remember what I'm talking about please let me know

Wild Card, Shadows, and Legacies have all gotten high praise out of the intricacies of their magical combat.
If there appears to be one thing I am tops at, it's bringing magic to the fights.

(now if you'll excuse me, I will hold that point of pride to my chest like one of those japanese bodypillow waifus and bemoan my (quite possibly imagined) inadequacies in other quarters of writing.)

Right, thank you for the recommendations But I can't write a story until I have the two characters appearing in it verified and accepted first! Maybe I should bin this for now and just make the plane...

So! Where do we start in creating characters for a Magic set? There needs to be a variety and yet balance...

There are a lot of different ways to do this, so you'll have to find one you like. Personally, I like to start by thinking about the story I want to tell. In your case, since you're thinking about it in terms of a Magic set, think about what you want the story of your set to be. What is happening? What is the nature of the world you'll be working with, and how does that reflect on the beings in that world? This isn't always possible, but I like to think of Magic sets as a slice of time, and each new set (typically) shows at least some progression in time until we complete the block. If that's the case, what is happening during that snapshot moment on your world, and how is it going to be reflected in the cards? Once you have an idea of that, you can start figuring out the individual stories that are likely to come about, and therefore the characters you will need for it.

Alternatively, some people prefer a more character-driven approach. Make some interesting characters and put them in situations to see what happens. Try to get into their heads and picture what they would do in a given circumstance. Both methods (and several more besides) are perfectly valid.