Well I'll be. That's a good a claim as any and, honestly, one I can actually believe. I happen to know your character does in fact influence your power and I can see a time-stopping knife wielder in service to a vampire getting a night kill. If we do have a doc out there this guy right here is a good a target as any to save.

Now we just need to figure out who to throw your powers against. Anyone want to admit being a Mallet-ite? Two people preferably so we can all but end this on night one.

Wow....a real D1 claim? And one that seems believable?

@Garren - I do always seem to end up as scum...of course, I always seem to get killed/lynched very early...

Even with SE's claim seeming legit, I think it's way too early to claim roles. There is a target on his back, however, were I mafia, I'd not likely target him early, as (assuming the claim is valid) he's much more likely to off town than scum early on...
Of course, that could be exactly what he wanted people to think...

Either way, if there is a doc (and it's not me!) I'd actually not save SE tonight, as I don't believe it would be a good idea for mafia to hit him this early.



I used to, but I don't anymore. I actually believe him, as, with the NLP not counting alignment claims, it's actually pretty easy to do.

As to past playing styles - I'll point out the expected change in mine for this game. Earlier, as in when the last games were played, I had alot more time than I do now...so, I was posting quite frequently, with more short posts. Alas, that is no longer the case, and I no longer am able to check NGA hourly. Now, I'm lucky if I can get on more than once a day. I do tend to check it on my phone, but rarely post that way, you know, cause it sucks. So, for this game, I expect to be more of a once or twice a day poster, which is why I'll likely be putting more effort (and length) into my posts.

Just trying to head off the "this is not like your past games" posts that I'm sure will happen.

Still too early for anything but a random vote.

As I said, I tend to believe SE's claim at this point (even if I think it was a bad idea).
Other than that, you are all scum in my eyes!

@Zinger
if you are active today, why not comment on some of the ongoing D1 points?

On the issue of Squinty's claim, I'm hesitant to believe it just because a pro-town killing role is excellent camouflage for any anti-town killing role. Early claiming, despite how ill-advised it often is if you are town, tends to make people more likely to accept that claim later on over other claims. So, if it's a clever ruse and we fall for it, we might easily be screwed over late game when people overlook Squinty in favor of newer issues.

Either way, with the claim of an additional killing role on the table, we should at least wait until after the first night to see if there are multiple killed before any real action is taken on Squinty.

Also, I would tend to agree with Neosilk that it's far too soon for us to be going claim wild. Though I do disagree on advising the doctor. Discussing the benefits and drawbacks of potentially healing Squinty is advisable, though. Obviously, healing him could save him from grisly death. It could also get you caught by scum assuming they have some type of watcher variant on their team. Or Squinty could be lying through his teeth and the doc trying to heal could meet his own demise instead. Of course, the same could be true of any potential target of a doctor, but I just want to point out the obvious in case some of it wasn't obvious.

Personally, I believe the claim on the character side.
Sakuya is too prominent to not be featured here, I imagine, so unless counter-claimed, he's probably Sakuya.
As Garren pointed out earlier, however, a name on its own means little.
Reasonably speaking, Sakuya would be Gensoukyou, but I imagine assuming as much is a dangerous road to travel down.

Strong FoS on Squinty_Eyes, Garren and Neosilk.

So we have a day one claim from Squinty_Eyes. Garren and Neosilk both saying they believe the claim to be true. I don't know much about the source material for this game, so I will have to look stuff up as we go. In looking up Sakuya_Izayoi this section popped out at me:



For those unaware Zun is the developer. So Squinty_Eyes' claim is one of someone who only appears and claims to be human but likely isn't. As well as not from Gensokyo.

She also works for and is insanely loyal to a vampire (Remilia Scarlet).




@Garren and Neosilk: So what about Sakuya Izayoi makes her believable as town?

Well firstly you got to separate character from town/mallet-ite status. Your character determines what power you will be given but is otherwise entirely independent of your alignment. In that regard time-stopping, vampire-serving chick makes a decent choice for a night kill so that's a claim I can believe.

As for his town status declaring his power this early, especially when it's one that could prove very bad for mafia during the late game, paints a big old target on Squinty's head. So either he is town hoping a doctor will save him and others can help direct his power constructively or he's pulling a double-bluff. At this point I haven't really got a reason to assume he's lying about anything so I got to assume he's telling the truth about his alignment too.

Nothing makes her more or less believable as town based on the TouHou flavor. Whatever her alignment turns out to be, it is ultimately in the hands of Scarlet. She could be Gensokyo. She could be Mallet. She could be some alignment we aren't even aware of. However, her character flavor does seem to line up nicely with some sort of killing role, which is what makes it fairly believable. Of course, we should harbor strong doubts about this claim, but as I pointed out, it's best to let it lie for at least a day to see if we have multiple deaths N1 to confirm that there is a secondary killing role other than the mafia. Running speculations on whether or not the flavor indicates alignment tends to be a dead end discussion.

Also, the hell is a strong FoS? If you find any them so suspicious, go with your gut and throw down a vote on one of them. It will hardly end the day if you do.

I like to see responses before I actually vote.

I just now actually went and read the flavor, then realized I had no idea what I was talking about.
Given the game being referenced, Sakuya *should* have a hard time being a mallet, though.

I'm sure it would be incredibly difficult for Scarlet to come up with some reason for Sakuya to be Mallet-Aligned.

But for serious.

One of the big things when designing a mafia game that is based on existing material is you generally try to avoid aligning the characters into groups based on that material. Otherwise, everyone can just claim their role D1 and we are very likely to catch scum. That Squinty's role shouldn't be Mallet-Aligned because of the material this game is based off of is a terrible assumption to make.

Well, at least I managed to spark some good discussion. Though I suppose I'm kinda sidelined for now since I can't do much more to save / damn myself after making a claim, eh?

~SE++

Unvote; Vote: Garren.
Niklor is most likely scum distancing, he's playing too seriously.

A vigilante hitting town is not too bad assuming he kills people that would end up getting lynched anyway, but still kinda bad.

@Neo:Can you at least post some one liners on the phone, it could help getting started the first day, even if you should probably stop after some time to not make the thread too long and discourage others from rereading it.
@ "new" players: on the bottom of the thread there is a sort by author function.


Actually, unvote; vote:Se_tiny.
For that post containing only the result of his research on the wiki.

And niklor didn't change his vote!It all makes sense:pariah,Niklor and se_tiny are the scum,GG./this line isn't serious, the reason for the first vote wasn't so serious either, but more than this line.

So I'm scum and you choose to vote for someone who is not me? Little lost on the logic here. Also, why are you playing a complex game like mafia if you aren't going to bother to take it seriously.



I see no reason to change my vote.

I see no reason not to take Squinty's word that he is a killing role. His alignment should be treated as not being town until proven otherwise though. In a situation where it's found that a player of non-town, non-mafia alignment has a secondary night kill, generally the consensus is that if he's found to be trustworthy enough, he'll be allowed to live while chained to do the killing of the majority, creating a second lynch with his kill. Given that SE came out with this information on his own and early, I think he would fit this bill for the moment.

So I propose through the course of the day that we throw two votes, the first to lynch, the second to kill through SE. We can proceed further with SE in the next day once we have more information coming in from the presence (or lack of) the second kill, if one of the two kills lines up to how we vote, and any additional information that might present itself through roles.

I'm going to be replaced on the 10th anyway, so I was mainly looking to start some discussion to not waste the first day, but you guys managed to do it this time.

I still like my vote on Se_tiny.
Voting garren doesn't look like a bad idea, but I sort of remember him being even more useless as scum last time, so I'm not sure.
Voting pariah seems useless at the moment, if he refuses to do anything we have a claimed vigilante, and lynching him doesn't give us so much information.

Personally, I prefer that town not lead the power roles around. If Squinty is town, his decisions are made based on who he thinks is scum. (Hopefully that's how he would choose his targets anyway.) If we allow town to lead him, given the presence of scum within the town, we may end up choosing just another townie for him to kill because of the hidden agenda of the scum. Now, if we find one or two of the mafia by chance, that's a whole different ballgame, but right now I'd prefer if we left Squinty to choose his own targets.

It's easy to start a discussion. If all else fails, just start insulting your fellow players until they respond. :v

I did the same thing in the Dante's inferno game. And people said the same thing they are saying now. "Don't look too much into flavor". Why add the flavor to the game if it is going to be so unimportant?



I'm assuming you mean Squinty here because Pariah has only confirmed and asked a question of confused.

By that reasoning, we should avoid lynching people.

If we could grant the power to control the lynch to a confirmed townie, I would do so in a heartbeat. The lynch is the only tool town always has, and it is a flawed one in that it can be directed and swayed by scum. If Squinty could only use his power with the approval and direction of town, that would be one thing. However, I see little need to handicap his ability, potentially giving scum another tool at their disposal.

I'm not advocating we don't use the lynch. I'm saying we shouldn't put the same restrictions on what might be a pro-town power role.

So just to confirm this is you saying you think I'm scum? I'm genuinely a little lost on that point. Also as far as I remember I don't think I've ever been scum. Unless you mean that one time I was Satan and purposely went out of my way to be an obtuse arse.

---

On the whole 'leading Squinty around' thing. No reason we shouldn't do what Numbers suggested. I'm not saying we remove all autonomy from Squinty but there really is no harm in giving him our hit lists. The more information he has to work with the better - yeah scum are going to try and influence him as well but that could still play to our favour. Especially if someone is really insistent he kill someone who then turns out to be town.

Also after thinking it through some Squinty is probably a neutral role but that's just me thinking too hard about things.