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PostPosted: Sun Jul 20, 2014 11:21 am 
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Not to downplay your mono black deck Mega but while trying it out I found a fight on Shandalar that uses the exact same deck (more or less). It has the exact same creatures/other spells anyway although I didn't see any Rune or Indulgent Demons. I did make him discard a Griselbrand though.

Then again a made a RDW/goblins deck and it turns out there's a fight on Ravnica (I think) with the exact same deck...card for card lmao.

Edit: The deck is good btw :)


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PostPosted: Sun Jul 20, 2014 11:58 am 
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Megamaster, is 4x Mind Rot working well for you? Doesn't it become a dead card really often?
Also, why aren't you running any recursion? Dead Reckoning is a sweet card, kind of like a burn spell and a vampiric tutor.

The creatures below 4cmc aren't that spectacular, but Giant Scorpion and Liliana's Specter seem pretty decent.
Agent of Fates is also very good, but not so much against an army of weenies.


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PostPosted: Sun Jul 20, 2014 12:16 pm 
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Nuke2099 wrote:
Not to downplay your mono black deck Mega but while trying it out I found a fight on Shandalar that uses the exact same deck (more or less). It has the exact same creatures/other spells anyway although I didn't see any Rune or Indulgent Demons. I did make him discard a Griselbrand though.

Edit: The deck is good btw :)


Shandalar has Riku of Two Reflections who uses whatever deck you are using. Yes, I played against my own mono-black control when I battled him and proved I can pilot my deck better than the AI can. Hurray for me.

Left4Doner wrote:
Megamaster, is 4x Mind Rot working well for you? Doesn't it become a dead card really often?
Also, why aren't you running any recursion? Dead Reckoning is a sweet card, kind of like a burn spell and a vampiric tutor.

The creatures below 4cmc aren't that spectacular, but Giant Scorpion and Liliana's Specter seem pretty decent.
Agent of Fates is also very good, but not so much against an army of weenies.


Usually Mind Rots you try to play early to get your opponent into topdecking or nearly to topdecking. Even later on, Specter's and Mind Rots basically force your opponent to play whatever they topdeck or they lose it. Also, if they draw cards and now have 1-2 cards in hand and they're tapped out, suddenly Mind Rot is looking pretty sweet. It also forces your opponent to play any combat tricks they have before they become tricks that cost you when you go to attack. There's also decent card draw in the deck, so even if I do have an extra mind rot, it's not usually too much of a detriment.

I don't really care for Dead Reckoning in the deck. It's good if you're using it to revive the big demons, but the reality is you'll need to play some removal spells before your demons hit the board, and that's where Dead Reckoning is lacking in this deck. This is why I run Ulcerate, Vicious Hunger, and Tribute to Hunger, as they're good options at almost any point in the game.

Agent of Fates isn't even in the deck because they're really nothing to trigger the Heroic in my build.

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PostPosted: Sun Jul 20, 2014 12:40 pm 
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Nuke2099 wrote:
Not to downplay your mono black deck Mega but while trying it out I found a fight on Shandalar that uses the exact same deck (more or less). It has the exact same creatures/other spells anyway although I didn't see any Rune or Indulgent Demons. I did make him discard a Griselbrand though.

Edit: The deck is good btw :)


Shandalar has Riku of Two Reflections who uses whatever deck you are using. Yes, I played against my own mono-black control when I battled him and proved I can pilot my deck better than the AI can. Hurray for me.

Left4Doner wrote:
Megamaster, is 4x Mind Rot working well for you? Doesn't it become a dead card really often?
Also, why aren't you running any recursion? Dead Reckoning is a sweet card, kind of like a burn spell and a vampiric tutor.

The creatures below 4cmc aren't that spectacular, but Giant Scorpion and Liliana's Specter seem pretty decent.
Agent of Fates is also very good, but not so much against an army of weenies.


Usually Mind Rots you try to play early to get your opponent into topdecking or nearly to topdecking. Even later on, Specter's and Mind Rots basically force your opponent to play whatever they topdeck or they lose it. Also, if they draw cards and now have 1-2 cards in hand and they're tapped out, suddenly Mind Rot is looking pretty sweet. It also forces your opponent to play any combat tricks they have before they become tricks that cost you when you go to attack. There's also decent card draw in the deck, so even if I do have an extra mind rot, it's not usually too much of a detriment.

I don't really care for Dead Reckoning in the deck. It's good if you're using it to revive the big demons, but the reality is you'll need to play some removal spells before your demons hit the board, and that's where Dead Reckoning is lacking in this deck. This is why I run Ulcerate, Vicious Hunger, and Tribute to Hunger, as they're good options at almost any point in the game.

Agent of Fates isn't even in the deck because they're really nothing to trigger the Heroic in my build.


It all makes sense that Riku would use your own deck against oneself :D I beat him too ^^


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 21, 2014 11:36 am 
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In my mono black build, I've traded the Ulcerates for Dead Weights.. I find them just as good at removal while having no health sacrifice, which sometimes makes the difference in a duel.


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 21, 2014 3:04 pm 
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In my mono black build, I've traded the Ulcerates for Dead Weights.. I find them just as good at removal while having no health sacrifice, which sometimes makes the difference in a duel.


I've decided to take 2 of both. Dead Weight suffers a lot of its non-instant speed, IMHO.

BTW, Mega, I like your decklist a lot! I took it as a base and made some changes to fit to my style, and now it plays just great! Gonna post my version tomorrow. Thank you for inspiring me to build a MBC, I didn't know what to to with the black pool at first.

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PostPosted: Mon Jul 21, 2014 11:10 pm 
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I hope it's okay to double post one in a while :) Here goes my current decklist:

Dark Matter (MBC)

24 x Swamps

21 x Creatures

4 x Pharika's Chosen
2 x Giant Scorpion
4 x Liliana's Specter
4 x Phyrexian Rager
2 x Graveborn Muse
2 x Indulgent Tormentor
1 x Shadowborn Demon
2 x Rune-Scarred Demon

15 x Spells

1 x Ulcerate
2 x Undying Evil
2 x Dead Weight
3 x Vicious Hunger
2 x Mind Rot
2 x Tribute to Hunger
3 x Flesh to Dust

Notes:

No fountains: I decided to stick to swamps only because not having a swamp when I needed it had hit me hard a few times. Not having a black mana to summon a Pharika's Chosen or to cast a Vicious Hunger sucks.

Undying Evil: I used to run a singleton just to test this combat trick and it worked very well for me. Actually, I consider it a removal (especially when being cast on the creature with deathtouch) for 1 black with a free +1/+1 counter on top. Plus, it often comes totally unexpected for my opponent.

Mind Rot: 4 copies is a little too much for me with 4 spectres already in the deck. And I usually have enough removal to deal with those fatties whom my opponent might have discarded with Rot.

Phyrexian Rager: Yep, 4 copies of it. IMO, card draw is crucial for success of this deck, so I thought I should use all the tools available to raise the chances of drawing the card I need the most. Also, it's often a chump blocker and a perfect taeget for Undying Evil along with Specter.

Griselbrand: I had it in my deck for a loooong time but didn’t manage to summon it even once! 8cmc hardcast is a too much without any tools to reanimate it (Rescue from the Underworld is too costy and slow, IMO) or my beloved Heartless Summoning from last year.

Removal: I still can’t decide on quantity of my removal spells and switch them a lot. I used to run 2 Ulcerates and 2 Dead Weights (as mentioned above) but first one often seems like an overkill and often hurts myself too much with such a little lifegain available. Also, Dead Weight is useful even in the late game to weaken enemy bombs or walls.

Shadowborn: I love this guy, used to run it in last year Dimir's and Lords of Darkness even though it wasn’t that popular. Removal sticked to 5/6 flier for 5 mana is too good to miss even with required sacrifice being a nuisance.

General strategy is to stall with deathtouch weenies till the arrival of big guys along with card draw, discard and removal of big dudes. Fliers could be a PITA but other than that deck seems to work great. Need to test it more though – I spend ~10 hours trying to get all the cards needed for it and only run this deck through couple of multiplayer matches.

Hakeem, I’m still waiting for your version of this year mono-black! Your decks were always my favorite through all these years :)

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PostPosted: Thu Jul 24, 2014 1:55 pm 
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My current build:

Absolute Darkness

24 x Swamps

2 x Ulcerate
4 x Undying Evil
2 x Dead Weight
2 x Vicious Hunger
2 x Mind Rot
2 x Tribute to Hunger
2 x Flesh to Dust

4 x Pharika's Chosen
3 x Giant Scorpion
3 x Liliana's Specter
3 x Phyrexian Rager
2 x Graveborn Muse
2 x Indulgent Tormentor
1 x Shadowborn Demon
2 x Rune-Scarred Demon

After some playtests i decided to try 4x Undying Evil. It works very well with Liliana's Specter, Phyrexian Rager, Shadowborn Demon, and Rune-Scarred Demon.

DotP 2015 does't offer too much options to build a decent mono black IMO!


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PostPosted: Thu Jul 24, 2014 4:11 pm 
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Given the absence of Sign in Blood from the cardpool, I think most black decks could benefit from a blue splash for Think Twice. I'm considering building a mostly black deck, but I think it would be a creature-based deck with Tormentors and Specters backed up by Paragons and Ragers with removal and a splash of blue for draw and tempo plays like Voyage's End.

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PostPosted: Thu Jul 24, 2014 10:04 pm 
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Hakeem928 wrote:
Given the absence of Sign in Blood from the cardpool, I think most black decks could benefit from a blue splash for Think Twice. I'm considering building a mostly black deck, but I think it would be a creature-based deck with Tormentors and Specters backed up by Paragons and Ragers with removal and a splash of blue for draw and tempo plays like Voyage's End.


IMO, 2 Muses and 4 Ragers give you plenty of draw, but, of course, Sign in Blood would be perfect... What I really miss this year is my favorite Grave Titan (it would be so good against all those tokens deck and a perfect target for Undying Evil after removal, also it would boost up Muse) and more useful/cheap graveyard recursion. Exhume or even Reanimate would be perfect for all the cheap creatures with EtB effects - Specters and Ragers, whom I have plenty of. Oh, and Corrupt. Corrupt is what I miss the most.

I've used Paragons a lot prior to obtaining Tormenters, Hakeem, but now there's just not enough space for them - I should either cut some removal (which is not a good idea, IMO) or some 3-drops (which I run 14 of but each of them is crucial for success of build).

BTW, my (well, mostly Mega's) current build works unexpectedly well - I have 12/2 W/L stats with it at the moment. One of the loses was to another MBC (he had perfect draws and I was mana flooded) and other to Baneslayer Angel (didn't draw a single removal, though I have tons of it).

Varg wrote:
My current build:

Absolute Darkness

24 x Swamps

2 x Ulcerate
4 x Undying Evil
2 x Dead Weight
2 x Vicious Hunger
2 x Mind Rot
2 x Tribute to Hunger
2 x Flesh to Dust

4 x Pharika's Chosen
3 x Giant Scorpion
3 x Liliana's Specter
3 x Phyrexian Rager
2 x Graveborn Muse
2 x Indulgent Tormentor
1 x Shadowborn Demon
2 x Rune-Scarred Demon

After some playtests i decided to try 4x Undying Evil. It works very well with Liliana's Specter, Phyrexian Rager, Shadowborn Demon, and Rune-Scarred Demon.

DotP 2015 does't offer too much options to build a decent mono black IMO!


Looks pretty similar to what I'm using :) Undying Evil is a trick that surprises a lot of people. Wish we had even more creatures with EtB effects.

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PostPosted: Thu Jul 24, 2014 10:58 pm 
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So I started brewing the deck that was supposed to be UB and ended up as a somewhat aggressive mono-black deck. I'm not sure how it happened, but here we go:

24 x Swamp

3 x Tormented Hero
3 x Ulcerate
3 x Undying Evil

2 x Bloodghast
4 x Child of Night

4 x Liliana's Specter
4 x Phyrexian Rager
2 x Tribute to Hunger
2 x Agent of the Fates
1 x Hall of Triumph

3 x Paragon of Open Graves
2 x Graveborn Muse

2 x Indulgent Tormentor
1 x Shadowborn Demon


I just won the first game I played with it and it felt strong. Could black aggro be somewhat real?

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PostPosted: Thu Jul 24, 2014 11:09 pm 
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tribute to hunger is suffering from the aggro meta, and agent of fates isn't that good if your only heroic triggers are undying evil and ulcerate.


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PostPosted: Thu Jul 24, 2014 11:25 pm 
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Hakeem928 wrote:
So I started brewing the deck that was supposed to be UB and ended up as a somewhat aggressive mono-black deck. I'm not sure how it happened, but here we go:

24 x Swamp

3 x Tormented Hero
3 x Ulcerate
3 x Undying Evil

2 x Bloodghast
4 x Child of Night

4 x Liliana's Specter
4 x Phyrexian Rager
2 x Tribute to Hunger
2 x Agent of the Fates
1 x Hall of Triumph

3 x Paragon of Open Graves
2 x Graveborn Muse

2 x Indulgent Tormentor
1 x Shadowborn Demon


I just won the first game I played with it and it felt strong. Could black aggro be somewhat real?


Hm, no Vicious Hunger, Dead Weight or Flesh to Dust? I get that it's an agressive deck but lack of removal might hit you hard, Hakeem. Other than that, your build looks interesting, I'll certainly give it a try.

Also, just a thought - with all the bonuses from Paragon and Hall of Triumth, I think you should give Demonic Appetite a chance - if cast on the right creature at the right time it can actually win you a game. Plus, it's a cheap trigger for Agent.

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PostPosted: Sun Jul 27, 2014 11:23 pm 
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Without looking at the other posts so if I have mirrored your deck let me know and I will call you a genius making a mono black deck with the dregs we have to work with. It's not all bad, but it's no Obliterator by any means.

For all the Grisel doubters I posted this deck in that thread on the front page. One time playing and loosing to G/W token, adjusted the land to 26 and the spoiler shows what happened.

Blue Oyster Cult

Premium

26 x Swamp


2 x Ulcerate
2 x Suffer the Past
3 x Tribute to Hunger
3 x Giant Scorpion
4 x Liliana's Specter
4 x Phyrexian Rager
4 x Assassinate
2 x Indulgent Tormentor
2 x Sanguine Bond
2 x Rescue from the Underworld
2 x Rune-Scarred Demon
1 x Griselbrand

3 x Elixir of Immortality


Spoiler

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PostPosted: Sun Jul 27, 2014 11:37 pm 
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Without looking at the other posts so if I have mirrored your deck let me know and I will call you a genius making a mono black deck with the dregs we have to work with. It's not all bad, but it's no Obliterator by any means.

For all the Grisel doubters I posted this deck in that thread on the front page. One time playing and loosing to G/W token, adjusted the land to 26 and the spoiler shows what happened.

Blue Oyster Cult

Premium

26 x Swamp


2 x Ulcerate
2 x Suffer the Past
3 x Tribute to Hunger
3 x Giant Scorpion
4 x Liliana's Specter
4 x Phyrexian Rager
4 x Assassinate
2 x Indulgent Tormentor
2 x Sanguine Bond
2 x Rescue from the Underworld
2 x Rune-Scarred Demon
1 x Griselbrand

3 x Elixir of Immortality


Spoiler


Interesting deck. If you are willing to elaborate on he specifics of the card selections, I'd appreciate it.


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PostPosted: Sun Jul 27, 2014 11:40 pm 
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Hakeem928 wrote:
So I started brewing the deck that was supposed to be UB and ended up as a somewhat aggressive mono-black deck. I'm not sure how it happened, but here we go:

24 x Swamp

3 x Tormented Hero
3 x Ulcerate
3 x Undying Evil

2 x Bloodghast
4 x Child of Night

4 x Liliana's Specter
4 x Phyrexian Rager
2 x Tribute to Hunger
2 x Agent of the Fates
1 x Hall of Triumph

3 x Paragon of Open Graves
2 x Graveborn Muse

2 x Indulgent Tormentor
1 x Shadowborn Demon


I just won the first game I played with it and it felt strong. Could black aggro be somewhat real?


Much more aggressive than the deck I am working on now (my first creation ever in the MTG universe, honestly). I think Tormented Hero is an underrated card, especially in a deck utilizing Agent and needing enchantments/spells/instants anyway.

How did this end up working for you long-term?


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PostPosted: Sun Jul 27, 2014 11:48 pm 
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Without looking at the other posts so if I have mirrored your deck let me know and I will call you a genius making a mono black deck with the dregs we have to work with. It's not all bad, but it's no Obliterator by any means.

For all the Grisel doubters I posted this deck in that thread on the front page. One time playing and loosing to G/W token, adjusted the land to 26 and the spoiler shows what happened.

Blue Oyster Cult

Premium

26 x Swamp


2 x Ulcerate
2 x Suffer the Past
3 x Tribute to Hunger
3 x Giant Scorpion
4 x Liliana's Specter
4 x Phyrexian Rager
4 x Assassinate
2 x Indulgent Tormentor
2 x Sanguine Bond
2 x Rescue from the Underworld
2 x Rune-Scarred Demon
1 x Griselbrand

3 x Elixir of Immortality


Spoiler


That's an interesting build, Devil. How are Sanguine Blood combos working for ya? Is it a win condition?

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PostPosted: Sun Jul 27, 2014 11:53 pm 
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JamesT wrote:
Without looking at the other posts so if I have mirrored your deck let me know and I will call you a genius making a mono black deck with the dregs we have to work with. It's not all bad, but it's no Obliterator by any means.

For all the Grisel doubters I posted this deck in that thread on the front page. One time playing and loosing to G/W token, adjusted the land to 26 and the spoiler shows what happened.

Blue Oyster Cult

Premium

26 x Swamp


2 x Ulcerate
2 x Suffer the Past
3 x Tribute to Hunger
3 x Giant Scorpion
4 x Liliana's Specter
4 x Phyrexian Rager
4 x Assassinate
2 x Indulgent Tormentor
2 x Sanguine Bond
2 x Rescue from the Underworld
2 x Rune-Scarred Demon
1 x Griselbrand

3 x Elixir of Immortality


Spoiler


Interesting deck. If you are willing to elaborate on he specifics of the card selections, I'd appreciate it.

All the creatures have an upside and I carry enough lifegain to offset Grisel and some of the other spells.
Rune-Scarred fetches Grisel.
It's a fun play.

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PostPosted: Sun Jul 27, 2014 11:55 pm 
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Lexxx20 wrote:
Without looking at the other posts so if I have mirrored your deck let me know and I will call you a genius making a mono black deck with the dregs we have to work with. It's not all bad, but it's no Obliterator by any means.

For all the Grisel doubters I posted this deck in that thread on the front page. One time playing and loosing to G/W token, adjusted the land to 26 and the spoiler shows what happened.

Blue Oyster Cult

Premium

26 x Swamp


2 x Ulcerate
2 x Suffer the Past
3 x Tribute to Hunger
3 x Giant Scorpion
4 x Liliana's Specter
4 x Phyrexian Rager
4 x Assassinate
2 x Indulgent Tormentor
2 x Sanguine Bond
2 x Rescue from the Underworld
2 x Rune-Scarred Demon
1 x Griselbrand

3 x Elixir of Immortality


Spoiler


That's an interesting build, Devil. How are Sanguine Blood combos working for ya? Is it a win condition?

Have only played the deck twice so far. I'm sure I will see what else it's capable of.

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PostPosted: Mon Jul 28, 2014 7:10 am 
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JamesT wrote:
Hakeem928 wrote:
So I started brewing the deck that was supposed to be UB and ended up as a somewhat aggressive mono-black deck. I'm not sure how it happened, but here we go:

24 x Swamp

3 x Tormented Hero
3 x Ulcerate
3 x Undying Evil

2 x Bloodghast
4 x Child of Night

4 x Liliana's Specter
4 x Phyrexian Rager
2 x Tribute to Hunger
2 x Agent of the Fates
1 x Hall of Triumph

3 x Paragon of Open Graves
2 x Graveborn Muse

2 x Indulgent Tormentor
1 x Shadowborn Demon


I just won the first game I played with it and it felt strong. Could black aggro be somewhat real?


Much more aggressive than the deck I am working on now (my first creation ever in the MTG universe, honestly). I think Tormented Hero is an underrated card, especially in a deck utilizing Agent and needing enchantments/spells/instants anyway.

How did this end up working for you long-term?


It's still sitting there because I've been working on WR Auras and plan to move on to Bant Species Gorger and WB Sanguine Bond before maybe returning to it.

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