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PostPosted: Mon Jul 14, 2014 4:56 am 
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Why play Spire Tracer rather than Triton Shorestalker ?
They have the same stats, but Triton Shorestalker is... totally unblockable.


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 14, 2014 5:15 am 
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The only reason someone would post a build like that with Spire Tracer over Triton Shorestalker is:

a) They're an idiot
b) They totally forgot Shorestalker was even a card
c) Some combination of a) and b)

Go with c)

Thanks for improving the deck pal. I would recommend making the full 4-of swap and dropping a Forest for another Island (I think 11 green sources is still sufficient, especially since Hydra is a 4-drop at the absolute non-desperation mode earliest)

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PostPosted: Mon Jul 14, 2014 5:34 am 
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Actually, how about including both ?
And a bigger set of Military Intelligence and Beastmaster Ascension ?


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 14, 2014 9:14 am 
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Ver. 1 With premium cards
Spoiler


Ver. 2 without premium cards
Spoiler


Ver. 3 (More control and resilience)
Spoiler


Okay. So, I was inspired by a user on the old forums by the name of "Latieon". According to him/her, there is an infinite Time Warp combo somewhere amongst this pile of cards. So...I took it one step further and built a deck around it.

The idea of this deck is to go infinite. Make as much mana as possible and tutor for your Archaeomancer. Then abuse the hell out of this card and go infinite Fog, or infinite Time Warp and draw out your deck. Then, once you hit Elixir of Immortality you cannot lose. Also, while drawing out your deck...you can sort of "go off" with Chasm Skulker and make a ton of tokens! This deck is very adaptive and I'd love criticism and ideas.
ADD TO THE KNOWLEDGE POOL...AND EVOLVE!

EDIT: Just had a thought. Since there are alot of scry effects in the deck...you could include Pyxis of Pandemonium and surprise your opponent with the combo OR include a Sphinx-Bone Wand because we have a few instants and soceries in here. There are multiple routes to victory here.

EDIT: Multiple versions of the deck. The most previous version is the most tuned.

I played with that deck, replacing the Genesis Hydra with Pelakka Wurm against the AI and it seems to work pretty well.
Actually , I'm tempted to replace the 2xPelakka Wurm by splashing for black and getting 2xRune-Scarred Demon to ease getting the combo.
Since there's already 3x Darksteel Ingot, you only need to replace some of the island / forests with swamps and gates that produce black mana to be fine.


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 14, 2014 10:27 pm 
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@Aranthys: I dropped a Bident for the 3rd Intelligence but would not recommend fitting in 4 more 1 mana 1/1s...because this build can't assemble an army as fast as a token build to fully take advantage of Ascension (which is why I only included it as a 1-of to break the occasional stalemate) because once you have the card drawing engine going, you end up drawing all those 1/1s.

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PostPosted: Mon Jul 14, 2014 11:28 pm 
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Here is another (possibly silly) idea for the thousand cuts deck. Wait for it...Kraken Hatchling in place of the other walls. Only costs 1 to put on the table and can also block 4 power dudes. But the real advantage is getting to draw off of those Military Intelligence sooner because if they don't have a 4 power guy Krack Hatch can pretty much just attack whenever. I'm still unlocking, but have been playing a deck similar to this one for my main deck against AI and have been consistently surprised at how often the Hatchling was relevant.


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 14, 2014 11:57 pm 
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It's not silly at all. There are differences though.

Grave Bramble:
- Wheat thresher opponent's dudes by forcing them to attack with Bident of Thassa
- Opponent more than likely will lose a dude by trying to swarm past your defenses

Kraken Hatchling:
- Way cheaper and evolves the Cloudfin Raptors at the same rate, and faster
- Can attack to trigger Military Intelligence and Beastmaster Ascension
- Less painful to Switcheroo than a Grave Bramble

I actually like the Hatchlings a lot on paper Ranccor. Back to the lab!

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PostPosted: Tue Jul 15, 2014 12:23 am 
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I gave the new build a couple of spins and I am extremely impressed/happy with the improvements. The community really came through with helping refine this build. Thanks bruhs! Shout outs to Aranthys and Ranccor. Here's my current landing spot:

0 (0): None

1 (12): 4x Kraken Hatchling, 4x Cloudfin Raptor, 4x Triton Shorestalker

2 (15): 3x Quickling, 3x Military Intelligence, 3x Voyage's End, 2x Genesis Hydra, 4x Elvish Visionary

3 (6): 2x Chasm Skulker, 2x Dissolve, 2x Beastmaster Ascension

4 (1): 1x Bident of Thassa

5 (3): 3x Switcheroo

6+ (0): None

Lands (23): 13x Island, 6x Forest, 4x Simic Guildgate

- Swapping 4 Defenders for 4 mostly-Defenders that can attack when needed is enough justification for me to slip the 2nd Beastmaster Ascension in. The swap from four 3s to four more 1s also makes your Genesis Hydras more likely to hit (and double evolve Raptor)

- Even though it's still a pretty low curve, I don't feel comfortable dipping below 23 lands

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PostPosted: Tue Jul 15, 2014 1:48 am 
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Any chance I can get some thoughts on this?

Simic Evolve-ETB Thing
x13 Forest
x8 Island
x4 Simic Guildgate

x4 Cloudfin Raptor
x4 Elvish Visionary
x3 Timberland Guide
x2 Battering Krasis
x2 Chasm Skulker
x2 Genesis Hydra
x4 Cultivate
x1 Triumph of Ferocity
x2 Inspiration
x2 Garruk's Packleader
x3 Species Gorger
x2 Doubling Season
x1 Time Warp
x2 Phytotitan
x1 Soul of Zendikar

So the basic idea is to use the effect of things like Species Gorger and Phytotitan to get a steady supply of things re-entering the battlefield both to trigger ETB effects as well as things like Garruk's Packleader and the evolve mechanic. At the same time the deck has a decent amount of draw power which should help it get the pieces it needs as well as buffing Chasm Skulker (which is always nice).

I'll justify Phytotitan since I think he's going to get some flak here. I actually like this card because it dies a lot. Yeah I know. Its mostly its 7 Pow and self-resurrection abilities that I like in this set up. It's power is high enough to trigger evolve until the point that it doesn't matter anymore and can reliably trigger both Garruk's Packleader when it comes back and Triumph of Ferocity when it sticks around. I know I could just play Terra Stomper or something in its place but I really like the way this interacts with everything else.

So thoughts and ideas? Is it a viable deck at all?

Edit
Changed from advice;
-1 Battering Krasis, +1 Cultivate

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PostPosted: Tue Jul 15, 2014 6:49 am 
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Both these builds (mobius and Garren) look like a lot of fun! I'm a "hands on" type of person so I won't be able to offer much advice until I get a feel for everything, but both these builds look solid. I kind of agree though Garren, seems like there's gotta be some way to fit in the stomper, lol, he is such a good card.

@mobius I'm noticing you have been consistently using all 4 gates in pretty much any dual-colored (or more) build, are they ever slowing you down too much?

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PostPosted: Tue Jul 15, 2014 7:46 am 
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THIS MY FINAL BUILD

Echoing Roar 2015 deck (Echoing Roar)
60 Cards. 34 nonlands (10 creatures, 24 spells). 26 Lands (12, 10 ).

Creature 10
-- 3x Elvish Visionary
-- 3x Archaeomancer
-- 2x Species Gorger
-- 2x Pelakka Wurm

Spell 24
-- 4x Fog
-- 4x Vapor Snag OR Void Snare
-- 3x Nullify
-- 2x Negate
-- 4x Think Twice OR Ior Ruin Expedition
-- 3x Cultivate
-- 3x Dissolve
-- 1x Time Warp

Land
-- 4x Simic Guildgate

EDIT: This is a combo-control deck. When you have 9 mana in play you can do this...

Species Gorger + Archaeomancer + Fog
Species Gorger + Archaeomancer + Time Warp

Species Gorger bounces your own creature of choice every turn at no cost so that you can keep using their "enter the battlefield ability". If you cannot use the combo, there is always Pelakka Wurm which can close out games on its own and makes use of the 7 life every time it enters play.


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PostPosted: Tue Jul 15, 2014 9:34 am 
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I'd actually run your deck as a three-color deck.

As it is, if you don't draw into your combo, you're dead.
Something like :

Here's Da Combo ! :
Lands (24):
8x Forest
6x Island
2x Swamp
4x Simic Guildgate
2x Golgari Guildgate
2x Dimir Guildgate

Creatures (12):
4x Elvish Visionary
4x Archaeomancer
2x Species Gorger
2x Rune-Scarred Demon

Spells (19):
4x Fog
2x Treasured Find
4x Voyage's End
3x Cultivate
3x Dissolve
2x Inspiration
1x Time Warp

Artifacts (4):
1x Elixir of Immortality
3x Darksteel Ingot


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PostPosted: Tue Jul 15, 2014 10:04 am 
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I like it!

This should be posted in the 3-color thread though.

I particularly like the Rune-Scarred Demon, Treasure Find, and Darksteel Ingot innovation here. With Elixir, you don't have to shuffle things like Cultivate back into the deck or Think Twice.


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PostPosted: Tue Jul 15, 2014 10:25 am 
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True. Let's do it this way then :

Here's Da Combo ! :
Lands (24):
8x Island
6x Forest
2x Swamp
4x Simic Guildgate
2x Golgari Guildgate
2x Dimir Guildgate

Creatures (15):
3x Elvish Visionary
3x Quickling
3x Archaeomancer
2x Saruli Gatekeepers
2x Species Gorger
2x Rune-Scarred Demon

Spells (17):
4x Fog
2x Treasured Find
4x Voyage's End
4x Think Twice
3x Dissolve
1x Time Warp

Artifacts (4):
1x Elixir of Immortality
3x Darksteel Ingot

The plan is easy enough :
- Stall long enough by abusing etb/bounce/fog effects to draw/tutor into combo then make fun of your enemy.
Edit.: Mana fixing + I did post the deck in the three-color deck thread.


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PostPosted: Tue Jul 15, 2014 12:23 pm 
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@Nebula: Nah, 4 Guildgates aren't mandatory for 2 color builds (I don't use them in the G/B Dredge deck or the R/W awful auras deck) and probably shouldn't be used for low-curve builds without strict double-mana requirements....such as this one! So I pulled my head out of my behind and went with 15x Island and 8x Forest.

@Garren: Have you tried that build yet? It looks fine if you can get it going, but that's a big IF. I know we don't really know the meta yet (the iPad meta, in my experience so far, is a lot of 80 card decks, STILL!, or 60 bad-card decks). I will say though, and go ahead everyone, call me cocky, if the meta were the 7 decks I've built thus far, you would have a hard time setting up, or I would simply set up faster. I would definitely get the 4th Cultivate in there, probably for an Inspiration. I can also tell you from experience (in Paper Magic and this iteration of Duels...especially this iteration of Duels) that Battering Krasis is underwhelming, at best.

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PostPosted: Thu Jul 17, 2014 2:45 am 
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Don't worry your not going mad. This is indeed pretty much the same list I posted a little ways above - only now with the benefit of having actually been used!

Evolution Cycle (Premium Build)
x13 Forest
x8 Island
x4 Simic Guildgate

x4 Cloudfin Raptor
x4 Elvish Visionary
x2 Timberland Guide
x3 Quickling
x2 Chasm Skulker
x2 Genesis Hydra
x4 Cultivate
x3 Nylea's Disciple
x2 Inspiration
x2 Garruk's Packleader
x3 Species Gorger
x2 Doubling Season
x1 Time Warp
x1 Soul of Zendikar

I was told Battering Krasis couldn't pull it's weight and that proved sadly true. Both of them, along with the entirely unnecessary Triumph of Ferocity (whose in game art sucks compared to this one), were cut to make way for a trio of Nylea's Disciples. The girls really helped this deck get over and recover from the early game hump while it get's its pieces into play - and once that happen it is beautiful. If the opponent is too slow to stop this thing coming online then they simply lose; massive card advantage, life gain and the largest creatures the game can handle - all this and more can be yours!

Seriously though while it may not be the most consistent deck I'm running it's certainly the funnest. Half the cards end up being entirely irrelevant once the engine goes live. I'm considering sticking some more Inspiration in there to speed up the initial hunts for parts but beyond that this is about the best I could hope for for this deck short of going the cheese route and building it to be an infinite Time Warp cycle.

Edit: Finally caved on the Phytotitan. They are simply unnecessary for this deck to succeed.
-2 Phytotitan, -1 Timberland Guide, +3 Quickling

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Last edited by Garren_Windspear on Thu Jul 17, 2014 6:41 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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PostPosted: Thu Jul 17, 2014 3:23 am 
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Don't worry your not going mad. This is indeed pretty much the same list I posted a little ways above - only now with the benefit of having actually been used!

Evolution Cycle
x13 Forest
x8 Island
x4 Simic Guildgate

x4 Cloudfin Raptor
x4 Elvish Visionary
x3 Timberland Guide
x2 Chasm Skulker
x2 Genesis Hydra
x4 Cultivate
x3 Nylea's Disciple
x2 Inspiration
x2 Garruk's Packleader
x3 Species Gorger
x2 Doubling Season
x1 Time Warp
x2 Phytotitan
x1 Soul of Zendikar

I was told Battering Krasis couldn't pull it's weight and that proved sadly true. Both of them, along with the entirely unnecessary Triumph of Ferocity (whose in game art sucks compared to this one), were cut to make way for a trio of Nylea's Disciples. The girls really helped this deck get over and recover from the early game hump while it get's its pieces into play - and once that happen it is beautiful. If the opponent is too slow to stop this thing coming online then they simply lose; massive card advantage, life gain and the largest creatures the game can handle - all this and more can be yours!

Seriously though while it may not be the most consistent deck I'm running it's certainly the funnest. Half the cards end up being entirely irrelevant once the engine goes live. I'm considering sticking some more Inspiration in there to speed up the initial hunts for parts but beyond that this is about the best I could hope for for this deck short of going the cheese route and building it to be an infinite Time Warp cycle.


I would put in a Terra Stomper long before I ever concidered Phytotitan. Also not to nag but you might want to list this as a premium build.


Last edited by Nuke2099 on Thu Jul 17, 2014 7:19 am, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Thu Jul 17, 2014 3:28 am 
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Oops. Updated to show it's a premium build. As for why Phytotitan he is in there mostly for his self-resurrection ability; it triggers Packleader and most evolution when it turns up again which is what I want it to be doing - plus he's a massive 'you *will* lose something if you attack me' warning to the opponents. Terra Stomper is fun don't get me wrong but this deck does not lack for big stompy things which is all Stompy brings to the table in that regard.

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PostPosted: Thu Jul 17, 2014 3:40 pm 
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Here's my U/G ramp deck that I've been running for a bit. (Contains premiums)

Brozilek
12 x Island
9 x Forest
3 x Simic Guildgate

2 x Kraken Hatchling
3 x Elvish Visionary
2 x Guard Gomazoa
4 x Coral Barrier
1 x Jalira, Master Polymorphist
1 x Genesis Hydra
1 x Roil Elemental
2 x Terra Stomper
3 x Pelakka Wurm
1 x Kozilek, Butcher of Truth

4 x Vapor Snag
4 x Think Twice
2 x Cultivate
3 x Inspiration
1 x Time Warp

2 x Darksteel Ingot


Draw: 14 (counting Think Twice twice; not counting Kozilek), 11 of which are instant speed
Bombs: 8
Control: 4 (not as many as I'd like, but it helps me go the distance)
Early defense: 11

Changes wanted in the future: -1 Inspiration, +1 Elvish Visionary; -2 Coral Barrier, +2 Cultivate; -2 Coral Barrier, +2 Guard Gomazoa


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PostPosted: Thu Jul 17, 2014 11:05 pm 
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Hey Mobius, you're still one of my favourite players here. :]

Can you share the most current build of your deck modified to include premiums? I know you'd trade Voyage's End with Vapor Snag.


Last edited by Overmaster on Thu Jul 17, 2014 11:17 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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