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KLD: Elemental Bond http://862838.jrbdt8wd.asia/viewtopic.php?f=61&t=16820 |
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Author: | callmemaggit [ Sun Oct 16, 2016 5:54 pm ] |
Post subject: | KLD: Elemental Bond |
I think this idea can work at last, now we have a bunch of amazing cards in the last 2 expansions for it Gruul is the real deal, although Golgari is tempting too...but Red also has many good cards for this deck, the energy subtheme goes better with it, and above all, Voltaic Brawler is almost a must So... Edit: the 2º, better version is at the bottom of the page Inexorable Bond 3 x Vessel of Nascency 3 x Fiery impulse 3 x Voltaic Brawler 2 x Scrapheap Scrounger 2 x Smuggler's Copter 2 x Grapple with the Past 3 x Harnessed Lightning 2 x Tireless Tracker 2 x Inexorable Blob 2 x Eldrazi Obligator 2 x Lathnu Hellion 3 x Elemental Bond 2 x Collective Defiance 2 x Bristling Hydra 1 x Verdurous Gearhulk 1 x Ishkanah, Grafwidow 1 x Woodland Bellower 6 x Mountain 6 x Forest 1 x Swamp 2 x Rootbound Crag 2 x Cinder Glade 3 x Aether Hub 4 x Evolving Wilds As you can see, there's included a little Delirium subtheme, which goes really well along the Elemental Bond main plan 18 out of our 18 creatures have 3 power or more Vessels helps with the mana and creature selection as always, and let us find our Bonds more consistently. Extra value from them. And Grapples with a Bond give us basically two cards for 1G...value city again VB is the best agressive 2 CC drop, and Scrounger deserves a spot if just for the recurring from the GY, which is nuts with E. Bond(s) Also, if he gets killed, he almost allow Delirium by itself Copter can look out of place, but the looting is so awesome for this deck...and it's really good by itself, obviously. Creature number 19 and 20 Same as Tracker, still very good in itself...but he on the contrary goes perfect with Bonds too, making the draw even more sick and fuelling the Bonds by himself Hellion packs a good punch, and when he gives you a card on the process...also, this deck many times needs or have spare Energy, with the HL, Hydras, VB etc...so more flexibility is always welcomed. Energy is the 3º theme, so to say Obligator is a long forgotten card, but here, at 3 power and with haste, he compliments really well the Hellions and the Bonds, allowing fast wins... and with the Hubs, t5 onwards is a devastating play when you include the Act of Treason effect Inexorable Blob, in a Delirium deck and with just one E. Bond on the board, becomes utterly busted...a free 3/3 creature and a free card in every attack is absurd C. Deff is very good at preventing mana or E.Bonds/Vessels flood, one of the few potential problems of this deck...and the face damage and removal, sweet The Hydras are resilient and can play with the energy too, so they are in Btw, beware of dropping 2 Bonds on the table against grindy decks...the possibility of milling yourself is very real, more than ever... Verdurous and Isky, just the 2 best 5 CC drops of Gruul... and with Avacyn and the Flagship, of the game Bellower almost doubles his value with every Bond on the board...and he tutors awesomeness here 24 lands...including 1 Swamp for the Scroungers and even Isky. Abbeys are tempting to include, I'll see how the mana goes. Fairly low curve, topping at six and with only 5 cards above 3 CC...but you usually swim in cards with this deck, so it's a good idea if most of them are cheap It's a bit early to say, but this is one of those decks that feel rounded up from the beginning, my first list was almost identical, playtesting hasn't changed almost anything, which is unusual I must precise: you usually don't play Bonds t3 in this build, unless you are out of critters, or have just a Tracker waiting for t4...this a pretty fast and agressive deck, with the VBs, the Scroungers, the Hellions, Obligators etc...Bonds is the awesome way in which you don't lose steam when your play your entire hand of threats in a few turns Edited, finally had to go to 24 lands |
Author: | Winningteam [ Sun Oct 16, 2016 6:44 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: KLD: Elemental Bond |
Ahkoum Firebird still can't target PLainswalkers? |
Author: | callmemaggit [ Sun Oct 16, 2016 6:56 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: KLD: Elemental Bond |
Winningteam wrote: Ahkoum Firebird still can't target PLainswalkers? I dunno, I barely see them, lol. But they have fixed almost all the disasters, so I guess so |
Author: | divinevert [ Sun Oct 16, 2016 8:37 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: KLD: Elemental Bond |
I use 2x Elemental Bond in my Gruul Midrange deck, but I use Matter Reshaper/Thoughtknot/Reality Smasher, so I'm basically 3-color with colorless. |
Author: | zzmorg82 [ Sun Oct 16, 2016 11:08 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: KLD: Elemental Bond |
Hmm, how do you feel about Reclamation Sage in here? It won't trigger the bonds, but having recurring enchantment hate is usually a problem for Vehicle and burn decks. |
Author: | Kel'Thuzad [ Mon Oct 17, 2016 12:58 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: KLD: Elemental Bond |
I had a lot of success in Origins/Zendikar by throwing Elemental Bond into my GB Elves deck, with most of them entering as 3 power. It's an underrated card. Are you getting that Swamp reliably enough to make use of Scrapheap Scrounger? Or using Aether Hub? |
Author: | callmemaggit [ Mon Oct 17, 2016 2:51 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: KLD: Elemental Bond |
divinevert wrote: I use 2x Elemental Bond in my Gruul Midrange deck, but I use Matter Reshaper/Thoughtknot/Reality Smasher, so I'm basically 3-color with colorless. That version can't be bad, indeed...I have to try that zzmorg82 wrote: Hmm, how do you feel about Reclamation Sage in here? It won't trigger the bonds, but having recurring enchantment hate is usually a problem for Vehicle and burn decks. He was there, one of the few changes...thing is, this deck is too fast to really care for enemy artifacts if it can do the rush thing...and too powerful if it manages to do the Bond thing...I always had better things to do with my mana in the playtesting than casting a Sage Kel'Thuzad wrote: Are you getting that Swamp reliably enough to make use of Scrapheap Scrounger? Or using Aether Hub? With the four EW, the lone Swamp and the 3 Hubs, that isn't a problem almost never...and a lot of times I want to have the Scrounger in the GY for a couple of turns to activate fast Delirium More problematic is securing a Hub for a t5-6 Obligator, but as that isn't a so vital play, I'm ok when I can manage it, and ok too when I can't...half the time I cast him t3 anyways... |
Author: | -DarkShock- [ Mon Oct 17, 2016 10:19 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: KLD: Elemental Bond |
I would only run 2x Bond because you only ever want 1 and I would probably include Flameshadow Conjuring in it's place as giving another draw and haste would be epic. |
Author: | callmemaggit [ Mon Oct 17, 2016 1:39 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: KLD: Elemental Bond |
-DarkShock- wrote: I would only run 2x Bond because you only ever want 1 and I would probably include Flameshadow Conjuring in it's place as giving another draw and haste would be epic. Making them just 2 is tempting, more so with the Vessels...but having 3 ups the consistency, and we have Copters and C.Deff to cycle our excess of Bonds...though call, time will tell I guess Lol, this thread comes from the Flameshadows one Timm posted a bit before...problem is, the creatures that are the best for FC aren't exactly the same that are the best for EB...close, but enough of a difference to make the mix of the 2 a bit weaker than the standalone versions, the just EB and the just FC ones...this build in fact started as an hybrid of the two, but soon it was obvious that was stretching too much the list I think this list is pretty strong |
Author: | stahlster [ Mon Oct 17, 2016 3:29 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: KLD: Elemental Bond |
I have also been messing around with a bonds build...the irony is that I have put bonds down 3 times (of 6 games played) and each time it has been destroyed immediately thereafter. Here are a few cards that are unique to my build that I don't see in yours (we run many of the same cards). My deck tries to hit hard after the third play. I'd post my entire list....but I don't have it in front of me Elvish Visionary - was trying to get bonds into my hands ASAP, wanted the card draw for this reason, but this card can be replaced - potentially with Cathartic Reunion? Lambholt Pacifist - great value card, synergy with bonds- I started with the same energy combo as you have with brawler/hydra/lightning- but decided to move away from the energy mechanic to Nature's Way Blossoming Defense and Built to Smash/ Lamby was the primary replacement for brawler Impetuous Devils - Hard hitter that if played properly can be a wincon/ game changer Mina and Denn, Wildborn - as opposed to ishkana- I didn't go with the delirium sub theme either- nice trample enabler - we should have plenty of land if we can get bonds up and running to activate. Blood Mist - maybe this could also be a Flameshadow Conjuring? Both have good synergy with the deck Embodiment of Fury - fits the fast/ hard hitting theme Chandra, Flamecaller - end of curve winner I think there are a bunch of ways to build around the bonds. I am planning to try your build and compare/contrast. |
Author: | The Secret of TIMH [ Mon Oct 17, 2016 3:40 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: KLD: Elemental Bond |
I burned myself out on Bond in BFZ era when I messed around with the card in around a dozen different decks... your list looks interesting tho so I may revisit and play yours. In my previous experience, I thought it best to run all 3 copies. When your deck is built to exploit it and is packed full of creatures that trigger it, I think it's best to make sure you get it out as early as possible. That you're drawing an extra card virtually every turn after it's out, drawing a redundant copy isn't too painful / an acceptable trade off for consistency drawing the 1st copy. When you have mana to spare casting extra copies, you can really get nutty card advantage (as you've noted, so nutty self mill is a possibility). |
Author: | callmemaggit [ Mon Oct 17, 2016 5:14 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: KLD: Elemental Bond |
stahlster wrote: Impetuous Devils - Hard hitter that if played properly can be a wincon/ game changer Those were one of the last cuts, when trimming the deck. I'm trying to be faster with my build than with Visionaries and Pacifists (the names say it all haha) The Secret of TIMH wrote: I burned myself out on Bond in BFZ era when I messed around with the card in around a dozen different decks... your list looks interesting tho so I may revisit and play yours. Just Brawlers make a huge difference, and Copters and Scroungers too, and the top end...believe me, now it's way better than in BFZ |
Author: | Spaceknight [ Tue Oct 18, 2016 8:44 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: KLD: Elemental Bond |
callmemaggit wrote: 20 out of our 20 creatures have 3 power or more So you're always tapping 3+ power to activate the Copter? That's a benefit of flying, card flow, and possibly pseudo-haste, but no power gain. Is that worth the copter? Or is there an actual creature to put in that 2-slot? |
Author: | divinevert [ Tue Oct 18, 2016 11:52 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: KLD: Elemental Bond |
Spaceknight wrote: callmemaggit wrote: 20 out of our 20 creatures have 3 power or more So you're always tapping 3+ power to activate the Copter? That's a benefit of flying, card flow, and possibly pseudo-haste, but no power gain. Is that worth the copter? Or is there an actual creature to put in that 2-slot? Yes, it's worth it. And yes the 3+ power creature is one coming into play without haste, so little lost for an aggressive deck. |
Author: | Eonblueapocalypse [ Tue Oct 18, 2016 12:00 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: KLD: Elemental Bond |
divinevert wrote: Spaceknight wrote: callmemaggit wrote: 20 out of our 20 creatures have 3 power or more So you're always tapping 3+ power to activate the Copter? That's a benefit of flying, card flow, and possibly pseudo-haste, but no power gain. Is that worth the copter? Or is there an actual creature to put in that 2-slot? Yes, it's worth it. And yes the 3+ power creature is one coming into play without haste, so little lost for an aggressive deck. Aye, having evasion and the looting ability is worth it alone. Even without any ways to abuse the looting ability (like Madness cards) the filtering it provides is pretty damn awesome for a deck looking to slam down creatures and attack each turn. Plus the aforementioned pseudo-haste, and the fact it makes the deck more resilient against sweepers and decks with a glut of spot removal. Kind of the same basic idea as my Rakdos Vamps list currently. Basically every turn you are putting one (or multiple) 3+ power creatures on the table. It becomes hard to keep up with after awhile unless we run into a Languish or Planar Outburst. I could only assume things play out pretty similarly here. |
Author: | callmemaggit [ Tue Oct 18, 2016 12:13 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: KLD: Elemental Bond |
Spaceknight wrote: callmemaggit wrote: 20 out of our 20 creatures have 3 power or more So you're always tapping 3+ power to activate the Copter? That's a benefit of flying, card flow, and possibly pseudo-haste, but no power gain. Is that worth the copter? Or is there an actual creature to put in that 2-slot? Yep As the guys mentioned, the looting and the resiliency makes it. Btw, had to go one more land...I was finding myself always wanting more land...maybe I'll have to go up to even 25...so Firebird out |
Author: | divinevert [ Tue Oct 18, 2016 12:14 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: KLD: Elemental Bond |
Eonblueapocalypse wrote: divinevert wrote: Spaceknight wrote: So you're always tapping 3+ power to activate the Copter? That's a benefit of flying, card flow, and possibly pseudo-haste, but no power gain. Is that worth the copter? Or is there an actual creature to put in that 2-slot? Yes, it's worth it. And yes the 3+ power creature is one coming into play without haste, so little lost for an aggressive deck. Aye, having evasion and the looting ability is worth it alone. Even without any ways to abuse the looting ability (like Madness cards) the filtering it provides is pretty damn awesome for a deck looking to slam down creatures and attack each turn. Plus the aforementioned pseudo-haste, and the fact it makes the deck more resilient against sweepers and decks with a glut of spot removal. Kind of the same basic idea as my Rakdos Vamps list currently. Basically every turn you are putting one (or multiple) 3+ power creatures on the table. It becomes hard to keep up with after awhile unless we run into a Languish or Planar Outburst. I could only assume things play out pretty similarly here. Even better, because the Bond means we could get wiped, have one creature in hand, and suddenly slam down 9 power over 3 bodies due to the extra drawing from Bond. |
Author: | Eonblueapocalypse [ Tue Oct 18, 2016 12:32 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: KLD: Elemental Bond |
divinevert wrote: Eonblueapocalypse wrote: divinevert wrote: Yes, it's worth it. And yes the 3+ power creature is one coming into play without haste, so little lost for an aggressive deck. Aye, having evasion and the looting ability is worth it alone. Even without any ways to abuse the looting ability (like Madness cards) the filtering it provides is pretty damn awesome for a deck looking to slam down creatures and attack each turn. Plus the aforementioned pseudo-haste, and the fact it makes the deck more resilient against sweepers and decks with a glut of spot removal. Kind of the same basic idea as my Rakdos Vamps list currently. Basically every turn you are putting one (or multiple) 3+ power creatures on the table. It becomes hard to keep up with after awhile unless we run into a Languish or Planar Outburst. I could only assume things play out pretty similarly here. Even better, because the Bond means we could get wiped, have one creature in hand, and suddenly slam down 9 power over 3 bodies due to the extra drawing from Bond. Sure, although Vamps have the chance to loot into Madness stuff too, so I think things are pretty similar. Getting wiped, slamming down a creature, piloting Copter, and looting a Bloodhall Priest onto the table (and getting a free Shock) has happened for me more often than it probably should lol. |
Author: | divinevert [ Tue Oct 18, 2016 12:41 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: KLD: Elemental Bond |
Eonblueapocalypse wrote: divinevert wrote: Eonblueapocalypse wrote: Aye, having evasion and the looting ability is worth it alone. Even without any ways to abuse the looting ability (like Madness cards) the filtering it provides is pretty damn awesome for a deck looking to slam down creatures and attack each turn. Plus the aforementioned pseudo-haste, and the fact it makes the deck more resilient against sweepers and decks with a glut of spot removal. Kind of the same basic idea as my Rakdos Vamps list currently. Basically every turn you are putting one (or multiple) 3+ power creatures on the table. It becomes hard to keep up with after awhile unless we run into a Languish or Planar Outburst. I could only assume things play out pretty similarly here. Even better, because the Bond means we could get wiped, have one creature in hand, and suddenly slam down 9 power over 3 bodies due to the extra drawing from Bond. Sure, although Vamps have the chance to loot into Madness stuff too, so I think things are pretty similar. Getting wiped, slamming down a creature, piloting Copter, and looting a Bloodhall Priest onto the table (and getting a free Shock) has happened for me more often than it probably should lol. No doubt (but I still think Rakdos is better as good stuff than strictly Vamps) |
Author: | callmemaggit [ Tue Oct 18, 2016 1:31 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: KLD: Elemental Bond |
Second version, trimmed of fat...I entirely cut the Delirium theme...I want to be as agressive as possible here, and Vessels and Grapples don't do damage... Even if that means that I have to play sub par creatures like Terrain Elemental Then: 4 x Galvanic Bombardment 3 x Voltaic Brawler 4 x Terrain Elemental 2 x Scrapheap Scrounger 2 x Smuggler's Copter 3 x Harnessed Lightning 2 x Tireless Tracker 2 x Shrill Howler 2 x Geier Reach Bandit 2 x Eldrazi Obligator 2 x Lathnu Hellion 2 x Elemental Bond 1 x Collective Defiance 1 x Blood Mist 1 x Verdurous Gearhulk 1 x Skysovereign, Consul Flagship 2 x Reality Smasher 6 x Mountain 5 x Forest 1 x Swamp 1 x Waste 2 x Rootbound Crag 2 x Cinder Glade 3 x Aether Hub 4 x Evolving Wilds 1 x Hanweir Battlements Better 4 Galvanics, as early removal is key More agressive 2 CC drops. More haste too, Bandits in. Howler/Chorus substitutes Blob...he makes early damage most of the time due to his ability...and late game, he becomes a powerhouse with Bonds, once flipped. Good synergy. Swapped one Bonds for a Blood Mist...in a deck with high power creatures, is lethal...and less possibilities of getting 2 or 3 Bonds in the hand, which hurts Now topping at 5...no Bellower, Flagship in...amazing when all our cretures can pilot it. Smashers in, instead of the Hydras...trample, haste and resiliency is too much to pass...and with the Mist, ouch. Anyways t4 I'm usually casting removal to let my creatures hit, losing the Hydras is no that problematic and t5-6 Smasher hurt. Trying 24 lands, it's low curve (4-14-12-1-4) but manahungry Feels way more compact and to the point |
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