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 Post subject: Re: Rules Q&A
PostPosted: Fri Apr 17, 2015 6:06 pm 
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Shadowchu wrote:
I guess my objection is that this could be a case of outside information? His friend did it through a judge but does that apply here? I completely agree with the idea that judges need to be able to step in and investigate because otherwise a lot more cheating and foul play would happen during events if you could only get penalized if a judge was watching. i just feel that this integrity was taken advantage of even if I don't think the people involved meant it.
No, Outside Assistance doesn't apply, at least not from what I can tell. This has nothing to do with the friend and everything to do with the responding judge.

From the sounds of it, the friend didn't actually offer your opponent any advice or even speak about the matter within earshot of you. I can maybe see an argument that he maaay have realized your opponent forgot trample and went angle-shooting hoping for exactly what happened, but that's ridiculously unlikely, especially since the Rhino died and trample therefore wasn't relevant to the current game state any more. It's far, far more likely that the friend just misheard, thought something was wrong, and then called a judge hoping to correct it, which is exactly what we want people who notice things going wrong to do at that level of play.

The real issue is that the floor judge perhaps didn't step cautiously enough when stepping in to investigate; it may have been out of inexperience, it may have been out of overzealousness, it may just have been an plain old ordinary oversight. But once it happened there's no way of correcting it. It's a learning experience for that judge; nothing more.

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 Post subject: Re: Rules Q&A
PostPosted: Fri Apr 17, 2015 6:09 pm 
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Shadowchu wrote:
I guess my objection is that this could be a case of outside information? His friend did it through a judge but does that apply here? I completely agree with the idea that judges need to be able to step in and investigate because otherwise a lot more cheating and foul play would happen during events if you could only get penalized if a judge was watching. i just feel that this integrity was taken advantage of even if I don't think the people involved meant it.
No, Outside Assistance doesn't apply, at least not from what I can tell. This has nothing to do with the friend and everything to do with the responding judge.

From the sounds of it, the friend didn't actually offer your opponent any advice or even speak about the matter within earshot of you. I can maybe see an argument that he maaay have realized your opponent forgot trample and went angle-shooting hoping for exactly what happened, but that's ridiculously unlikely, especially since the Rhino died and trample therefore wasn't relevant to the current game state any more. It's far, far more likely that the friend just misheard, thought something was wrong, and then called a judge hoping to correct it, which is exactly what we want people who notice things going wrong to do at that level of play.

The real issue is that the floor judge perhaps didn't step cautiously enough when stepping in to investigate; it may have been out of inexperience, it may have been out of overzealousness, it may just have been an plain old ordinary oversight. But once it happened there's no way of correcting it. It's a learning experience for that judge; nothing more.

Okay, this was really helpful. Thank you.

Just wanted to make sure everything went correctly, seems that it did but it was just an unfortunate situation.

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 Post subject: Re: Rules Q&A
PostPosted: Sun Apr 19, 2015 9:44 am 
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On MTGO the trample damage is assigned automatically, no?

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 Post subject: Re: Rules Q&A
PostPosted: Sun Apr 19, 2015 10:48 am 
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It auto assigns maximum damage to player, but allows you to adjust it to deal more to the creature.

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 Post subject: Re: Rules Q&A
PostPosted: Sat Apr 25, 2015 6:18 am 
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Shadowchu wrote:
POSValkir wrote:
Shadowchu wrote:
I know this but I don't want to really want to do this. I think it lowers the quality of the tournament as a whole.

So you think that lowers the quality of the tournament, but you're upset that someone reminded a player of a stupid mistake?

I honestly think its a bit shady of someone not to personally remind an opponent of trample damage.

There's a difference in not advising your opponent on how they tap their lands and telling the opponent they missed something that very clearly would have happened outside of a slip of the mind. The instances in which its better to assign all the trample damage to the creature rather than the opponent are so few and far between its just polite to clarify that they are assigning it all to your creature.

Even if the amount you took that turn wouldn't have changed since the opponent announced damage, a polite reminder doesn't really affect the game.

Edit: and as far as the actual event. I was as confused as Grifter regarding the blocking, but I think the rest of the post sums up my feelings on the actual event pretty well. (as for the blocking...blocking the trample seems to prevent taking future damage when you only have the 3/3 left after the interaction. May not have been a bad call not knowing the rest of the game details. Based on what was said only I would have assumed the opponent would have let Rhino through and saying "take 4" would have been a real possibility based solely on that expectation. Dumb mistakes happen.)

Why would I remind my opponent of trample damage when it is his job to assign it. It's like reminding your opponent that he could play a land for the turn, or cast a spell. If my opponent doesn't know the rules of the game it's not my job to teach him. I think the people calling my play shady are people who don't understand the rules, quite frankly. You are allowed to assign trample damage the way you want.

I was playing for top-8. Next time you're a tournament, practice what you preach and give your opponent strategical advice during the game. After the game, I'm glad to talk about decks and game play decisions. During the game, I'm not going to give them any help. I didn't try to scum the guy, he's the one that said "take 4". I don't know why, but ignorant people keep thinking I'm an angle shooter for doing what I did.

I really don't think you understand how Competitive REL events work. It's fine that you want to have an opinion on the situation but maybe you should familiarize yourself with the tournament scene and environment more before making judgments of people.


I'm with 'Chu on this one, this is an actual real tournament where people are competing. If you're shagging around at FNM or in an otherwise more "for fun" scenario, then yeah I do the reminder thing all the time. But context is a thing and in a real tourney it's your opponent's job to concentrate and play the game well.

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 Post subject: Re: Rules Q&A
PostPosted: Mon Apr 27, 2015 11:13 am 
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What's a good way to ask if your opponent has tricks when you're the defending player and you're holding removal up? I realized yesterday that I've just been asking "damage?" which is probably wrong—nobody has misunderstood what I mean so far, but technically it sounds like I'm proposing a shortcut in which I pass priority during the declare blockers step.


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 Post subject: Re: Rules Q&A
PostPosted: Mon Apr 27, 2015 11:25 am 
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"You have priority in declare blockers."

(Usually, "I declare no blocks. You have priority." or "I block Foo with Bar. You have priority.")


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 Post subject: Re: Rules Q&A
PostPosted: Mon Apr 27, 2015 3:09 pm 
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"effects?" should work.

:duel:

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 Post subject: Re: Rules Q&A
PostPosted: Mon Apr 27, 2015 4:10 pm 
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Ya, usually people just respond by declaring blockers or saying "No Blocks." At which point priority is passed back to the opponent for the post Declare Blockers step, where both players can play instants or activate abilities.


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 Post subject: Re: Rules Q&A
PostPosted: Mon Apr 27, 2015 5:23 pm 
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I normally go with "no blocks" or "done blocking" in paper magic. If I feel the need to prompt my opponent further I ask for any effects.

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 Post subject: Re: Rules Q&A
PostPosted: Fri May 01, 2015 2:42 pm 
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I ask my opponent if they have any cookies.

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 Post subject: Tiny leaders question
PostPosted: Sun May 03, 2015 2:23 pm 
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If a have Varolz, the Scar-Striped as my general, and Death's Shadow in the graveyard could I scavenge it for 13 +1/+1? or do I have to check my life in order to know how many counters could I get?


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PostPosted: Sun May 03, 2015 2:35 pm 
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If a have Varolz, the Scar-Striped as my general, and Death's Shadow in the graveyard could I scavenge it for 13 +1/+1? or do I have to check my life in order to know how many counters could I get?

Death's Shadow's ability only functions while it's on the battlefield, so everywhere else it's power is 13.

So yep! That's a legitimate way to get a 15/15 Troll. (Or a +13/+13 anything else.)

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 Post subject: Re: Rules Q&A
PostPosted: Sun May 03, 2015 9:45 pm 
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Death's Shadow and Phyrexian Dreadnought are awesome cards in Varolz EDH / Tiny Leaders.


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 Post subject: Re: Rules Q&A
PostPosted: Thu May 21, 2015 9:59 am 
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If I activate Spikeshot Elder and the elder gets removed in response, I still get to deal damage and last known information is used to determine how much damage.

So how come if I cast Flesh // Blood (blood to make my bear deal damage to something) and my grizzly bear is removed in response, nothing happens?


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 Post subject: Re: Rules Q&A
PostPosted: Thu May 21, 2015 10:00 am 
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because a spell that resolves without a legal target fizzles


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 Post subject: Re: Rules Q&A
PostPosted: Thu May 21, 2015 10:31 am 
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It doesn't fizzle though, because the target that is intended to receive the damage is still legal. It resolves and does nothing according to the rulings.

Another random question: Can I make someone lose 5 life by Redirecting their spell to my Forsaken Wastes?


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 Post subject: Re: Rules Q&A
PostPosted: Thu May 21, 2015 10:45 am 
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Flopfoot wrote:
If I activate Spikeshot Elder and the elder gets removed in response, I still get to deal damage and last known information is used to determine how much damage.

So how come if I cast Flesh // Blood (blood to make my bear deal damage to something) and my grizzly bear is removed in response, nothing happens?

The spell doesn't "see" the creature until it resolves, so there is no last known information.

As for your other question, I think they do lose life, but I'm not 100% certain.

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 Post subject: Re: Rules Q&A
PostPosted: Thu May 21, 2015 11:17 am 
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For your first question, the difference is that Blood is trying to target your Bears. When Blood goes to resolve, if your Bears aren't there any more, they're not a legal target for Blood, and a spell can't do things to an illegal target (such as forcing it to deal damage to the other creature). Spikeshot Elder's ability has no such problems, because it's not trying to target the Elder.


As for your second question, yes, you can cause them to lose life if you Redirect a spell to your Wastes; the trigger condition for the Wastes is "Whenever Forsaken Wastes becomes the target of a spell...", and changing something's target to the Wastes counts. Be aware, though, that in order for you to be able to do that, the spell has to be something that could target the Wastes in the first place--Mortify could be redirected to it, for example, but Putrefy could not. When you change targets, the new target has to be legal.

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 Post subject: Re: Rules Q&A
PostPosted: Fri May 22, 2015 1:15 pm 
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So, I recently started reading the Tournament Rules, and among them is Rule 2.5, End of Match Procedure:

"In single-elimination rounds, matches may not end in a draw. If all players have equal game wins, the player with
the highest life total wins the current game. In the event all players have equal life totals (or are between games
and the game wins are tied), the game/match continues with an additional state-based action: if a player does not
have the highest life total, he or she loses the game. "

So it is a single elimination round that went to time and has gone past turns. My opponent and I are both at two, I cast Sarkhan's Rage at my opponent's face without a dragon. She goes to -3 and I go to 0, do we go to the next game or do I win?

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