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PostPosted: Tue Nov 24, 2015 12:09 pm 
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Has the thing that lets us post decks in pretty colors been updated yet?
I'd like to post my enchant build, but I don't want to post bunch of text since there exists a better format.

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PostPosted: Tue Nov 24, 2015 1:55 pm 
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chile125 wrote:
Has the thing that lets us post decks in pretty colors been updated yet?
I'd like to post my enchant build, but I don't want to post bunch of text since there exists a better format.

I think the last update was for duels 2015 and I thought he didn't wanna continue.


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 24, 2015 5:05 pm 
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Nono it works fine. Check the sticky thread. Some hero picked up the flag and ran with it


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 24, 2015 9:29 pm 
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Ran it through Ranked at Rank 40 for 5 matches. Tested 4-1, with the loss being against aggro and the wins being against midrange and control decks. The deck is strong against those sort of decks because they typically relied on 1 for 1 removal, and this deck tends to make enough tokens to eventually outgrind them. I see this deck struggling in match-ups that are also enchantment related, as the deck has no way to deal with opposing enchantments. The deck also doesn't have hard removal, which can be an issue when you Coils a creature (i.e, Kytheons Irregulars) that have a solid activated ability. Yes, you do have Suppression Bonds, but you struggle only having two answers to Planeswalkers, activated abilities on creatures, activated enchantments (particularly Evo Leap). Coils is a good card to be able to tutor for, but Abzanchantments is probably is stronger. In its current form, this deck has issues trying to close the game because it takes a while to build a critical mass of tokens, the Roils lets the opponent still chump block (and there are a surprising about of decently sized butts now, of x/3 variety). If you anticipate a meta where there is little aggro and a lack of Sphnix's Tutelage (as we have no answer to a resolved one), this deck would be a good choice. The weakest cards are the U retreat, the Eldrazi package (From Beyond, Ulamog). Kiora was mediocre, but she always required a relatively immediate answer. I would likely do these changes:

-1 U Retreat (weakest retreat)
-2 From Beyond (always felt mediocre)
-1 Ulamog (getting rid of From Beyond feels like getting rid of this)
-1 Zendikar's Roil (isn't a bad card, just has no affect once it hits the board; often feels win-more, but feels necessary to the game this deck is playing, could also be -1 Kiora)
+2 Angelic Retreat (gives you answers to cards you otherwise have no answer to)
+3 Jaddi Offshoot (gives us some early game defenders and incidental lifegain, also one of the best 1 drops in the current set)


Duel 1 [W], vs UW Tempo: Same UW tempo deck from last format. UW has always been relatively creature light, so was able to answer all of the creatures with Coils. Issue was that Kytheon's Irregulars could still tap cards, so it ended up being an extremely grindy game The lack of hard removal and enchantment removal was very obvious (ended up having Kiora and Gideon Suppression Bound, and several Angels Claustrophobia'ed). Eventually grinded it out by just making a lot of tokens, but it's clear from the start that this deck is going to struggle in the mirror and against evoleap decks.

Duel 2 [W], vs UB Mill: Ramped into a T3 Herald, T4 Gideon, T5 Roil+land, and made 2 dudes every turn. Nothing too interesting here to be honest. The mill deck was never able to play a Tutelage, so there wasn't much resistance to speak of.

Duel 3 [L], vs Mono-W Aggro: Curved Vanguard into Topan into Castigator, so he had a fairly strong curve. I mulliganed into a hand of Roil, Nissa, and Coils with 4 lands. Ended up drawing into a bunch of cards that didn't affect the board (Roil, Sigil, etc).

Duel 4 [W], vs BUG Control: Played an early Evo Leap, but I was able to tutor a Bonds for it. He flipped a Nissa, got good advantage off of it, and used Jace's looting several times. Eventually killed Nissa, and Jace flipped. His deck honestly had some issues as it was playing for the Eldrazi Sac flavor, which doesn't have enough support. Was able to do some strong players with G Retreat + Evolving Wilds for multiple triggers.

Duel 5 [W], vs WUBG Sac: Lots of clogging the ground with Heliod Pilgrims tutoring for Coils until you can get a token generator. They never got a good sac outlet until about turn 8 (which, even then, was only Voracious Thrall). You really feel the pain of having no early or midgame options of getting through x/3 butts, as Coils lets the creatures block. If they drew into Evo Leap, I would've been able to tutor for Bonds instead of Coils, so I feel like I would've done well in this match-up regardless of how it was played.


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 24, 2015 9:36 pm 
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AmeOtani wrote:


Ran it through Ranked at Rank 40 for 5 matches. Tested 4-1, with the loss being against aggro and the wins being against midrange and control decks. The deck is strong against those sort of decks because they typically relied on 1 for 1 removal, and this deck tends to make enough tokens to eventually outgrind them. I see this deck struggling in match-ups that are also enchantment related, as the deck has no way to deal with opposing enchantments. The deck also doesn't have hard removal, which can be an issue when you Coils a creature (i.e, Kytheons Irregulars) that have a solid activated ability. Yes, you do have Suppression Bonds, but you struggle only having two answers to Planeswalkers, activated abilities on creatures, activated enchantments (particularly Evo Leap). Coils is a good card to be able to tutor for, but Abzanchantments is probably is stronger. In its current form, this deck has issues trying to close the game because it takes a while to build a critical mass of tokens, the Roils lets the opponent still chump block (and there are a surprising about of decently sized butts now, of x/3 variety). If you anticipate a meta where there is little aggro and a lack of Sphnix's Tutelage (as we have no answer to a resolved one), this deck would be a good choice. The weakest cards are the U retreat, the Eldrazi package (From Beyond, Ulamog). Kiora was mediocre, but she always required a relatively immediate answer. I would likely do these changes:

-1 U Retreat (weakest retreat)
-2 From Beyond (always felt mediocre)
-1 Ulamog (getting rid of From Beyond feels like getting rid of this)
-1 Zendikar's Roil (isn't a bad card, just has no affect once it hits the board; often feels win-more, but feels necessary to the game this deck is playing, could also be -1 Kiora)
+2 Angelic Retreat (gives you answers to cards you otherwise have no answer to)
+3 Jaddi Offshoot (gives us some early game defenders and incidental lifegain, also one of the best 1 drops in the current set)


Duel 1 [W], vs UW Tempo: Same UW tempo deck from last format. UW has always been relatively creature light, so was able to answer all of the creatures with Coils. Issue was that Kytheon's Irregulars could still tap cards, so it ended up being an extremely grindy game The lack of hard removal and enchantment removal was very obvious (ended up having Kiora and Gideon Suppression Bound, and several Angels Claustrophobia'ed). Eventually grinded it out by just making a lot of tokens, but it's clear from the start that this deck is going to struggle in the mirror and against evoleap decks.

Duel 2 [W], vs UB Mill: Ramped into a T3 Herald, T4 Gideon, T5 Roil+land, and made 2 dudes every turn. Nothing too interesting here to be honest. The mill deck was never able to play a Tutelage, so there wasn't much resistance to speak of.

Duel 3 [L], vs Mono-W Aggro: Curved Vanguard into Topan into Castigator, so he had a fairly strong curve. I mulliganed into a hand of Roil, Nissa, and Coils with 4 lands. Ended up drawing into a bunch of cards that didn't affect the board (Roil, Sigil, etc).

Duel 4 [W], vs BUG Control: Played an early Evo Leap, but I was able to tutor a Bonds for it. He flipped a Nissa, got good advantage off of it, and used Jace's looting several times. Eventually killed Nissa, and Jace flipped. His deck honestly had some issues as it was playing for the Eldrazi Sac flavor, which doesn't have enough support. Was able to do some strong players with G Retreat + Evolving Wilds for multiple triggers.

Duel 5 [W], vs WUBG Sac: Lots of clogging the ground with Heliod Pilgrims tutoring for Coils until you can get a token generator. They never got a good sac outlet until about turn 8 (which, even then, was only Voracious Thrall). You really feel the pain of having no early or midgame options of getting through x/3 butts, as Coils lets the creatures block. If they drew into Evo Leap, I would've been able to tutor for Bonds instead of Coils, so I feel like I would've done well in this match-up regardless of how it was played.


Thanks for the info, I appreciate it. I suspect the deck is just a cute project, because the new ramp and control decks can clearly just go bigger.

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PostPosted: Tue Nov 24, 2015 9:49 pm 
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Well, it was fun endlessly blocking a pair of twins till i got out my own Ulamog, so it's certainly feeling very fresh (especially after the misery of zendikar's roil/valor of akros decks in Origin), but it probably isn't even solid T2 yet (though i'm cheering for it to grow) :)


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 25, 2015 9:21 pm 
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I want to play around with this neat deck idea. It includes manlands as win conditions. Here we have 8 spells to make use of your lands, and 4 manlands.

2 Scatter to the Winds
3 Roil Spout
2 Planar Outburst
1 Part the Waterveil

2 Shambling Vent
2 Lumbering Falls

Also, we've got land ramp in the format in the form of...
Ideally, we want 10-12 pieces of ramp. I put an "X" next to the ones I did not like.

2 Animist's Awakening
4 Swell of Growth X
4 Natural Connection
4 Nissa's Pilgrimage X
2 From Beyond
4 Mwonvuli Acid-MossX
2 Nissa's Renewal


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PostPosted: Thu Nov 26, 2015 12:41 am 
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 26, 2015 6:55 pm 
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Sorry geg, did not pas the RDW test on the draw. full of RDW this evening.This version can only beat em on the play. 0/4 on the draw 1/1 on the play. All RDW. Back to the drawing board. I think having spot removal up and max connection to use the mana efficiently each turn may be the only way to do this unless you wanna just scoop to aggro.


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PostPosted: Thu Nov 26, 2015 7:16 pm 
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It's a coinflip against RDW, not aggro in general. RDW is the only deck that's fast enough - with a good hand on the play that is.

I've been playing the dark side lately to get a feel for aggro in this meta. Trust me, even RDW doesn't get a good hand every time. In fact I probably lost more than I won with blue's list and it's not like you can make many mistakes with that archetype.

So yes, the matchup is in RDW's favour, but I have yet to discover what else this deck is weak against. Whenever I survive 4 turns, I've come to expect a win (unless I do something stupid like skipping my attack phase... I swear I lose so many games to interface accidents). I encounter 90% mid or lategame decks and have a good game against them. I accept the occasional auto loss against players piling enchantments onto a 1-drop.

Single target removal helps a little, I've tried. However, it's been stuck in my hand far more often, wishing to be a sweeper. Of course I wouldn't play this deck if I met 100% RDW like you did, but as long as ramp is so popular, there's no reason to cripple my good matchups in favour of a bad one.


Last edited by Gegliosch on Thu Nov 26, 2015 7:48 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Thu Nov 26, 2015 7:34 pm 
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Sorry geg, did not pas the RDW test on the draw. full of RDW this evening.This version can only beat em on the play. 0/4 on the draw 1/1 on the play. All RDW. Back to the drawing board. I think having spot removal up and max connection to use the mana efficiently each turn may be the only way to do this unless you wanna just scoop to aggro.

I apologize; I lost a series of control mirrors and fun deck marches, so in my anger I turned to RDW for about 10-12 straight games. I'm sure the effects of such cascaded and many switched over to aggro as a result.

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PostPosted: Fri Nov 27, 2015 12:24 am 
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 01, 2015 9:19 am 
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 01, 2015 9:43 am 
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This is very close to the list I started with. It also had Displacement Waves, Roil Spouts, Clutch of Currents and Kiora. I'd be interested how it performs for you - I used to run out of steam with it and after the first few changes, others followed for better synergies with what I just put in. I ended up with a completely different deck and way less of the cool bounce stuff than I wanted, but my results are much better now.


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 01, 2015 12:27 pm 
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Valor outside Akros

4 x Gatecreeper Vine
2 x Evolutionary Leap
1 x Nissa, Vastwood Seer
3 x Retreat to Emeria
1 x Gideon, Ally of Zendikar
2 x Hero of Goma Fada
2 x Planar Outburst
2 x Tragic Arrogance
2 x Emeria Shepherd

3 x Telling Time
1 x Retreat to Coralhelm

3 x Nissa's Pilgrimage
2 x From Beyond
1 x Greenwarden of Murasa

1 x Kiora, Master of the Depths
4 x Alchemist's Vial

4 x Plains
4 x Island
10 x Forest
1 x Canopy Vista
1 x Prairie Stream
2 x Hinterland Harbor
2 x Glacial Fortress
2 x Sunpetal Grove


NOTE: I don't have all cards so that explains the singletons of Retreat to Coralhelm, Canopy Vista and Prairie Stream.

Strategy: Dig for Gideon, Ally of Zendikar and Emeria Shepherd so you can keep Gideon giving you ultimates for fun and giggles. Alchemist's Vial is cheap draw that can also be used in defense whilst also recurred with Emeria Shepherd.


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 01, 2015 2:57 pm 
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I refuse to run Greenwarden of Murasa until they fix him. 6 mana Regrowth is not that appealing. Now if he had Trample, I'd run him bugs and all.


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 01, 2015 4:38 pm 
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I refuse to run Greenwarden of Murasa until they fix him. 6 mana Regrowth is not that appealing. Now if he had Trample, I'd run him bugs and all.


Well, it's only in as an extra Emeria Shepherd. Besides, you won't need to use its second ability: just get it back with Emeria Shepherd and you can use his ability again.


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 01, 2015 7:20 pm 
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Empo wrote:
I refuse to run Greenwarden of Murasa until they fix him. 6 mana Regrowth is not that appealing. Now if he had Trample, I'd run him bugs and all.


Well, it's only in as an extra Emeria Shepherd. Besides, you won't need to use its second ability: just get it back with Emeria Shepherd and you can use his ability again.


Hm, that's fair. I haven't actually made a W/G ramp-and-stamp deck yet, might try that out next.


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 01, 2015 8:38 pm 
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I'd suggest Evolving Wilds, so you can protect your allies from removal with Hero of Goma Fada and Retreat to Emeria out.


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 01, 2015 8:52 pm 
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Gegliosch wrote:
I'd suggest Evolving Wilds, so you can protect your allies from removal with Hero of Goma Fada and Retreat to Emeria out.


My hats off to you. I felt like my 5-color Allies deck was missing some spice so now I can just switch Retreat to Emeria in instead of Unified Front!


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