Like I said earlier, I didn't ever see the Maniac enter the battlefield. I just won the game once the Seance trigger resolved. Think Twice isn't necessary if you exile Maniac on your own turn with an empty library because you will just win.

The steps aren't in the wrong order though.

the problem is the tokens coming in don't need to be resolved it's only the effect of seance that resolves
and the steps are in the proper order for it's always untap, upkeep, draw

I think you still need a couple of think twice for when you have to hard cast lab maniac, you can then draw the card and win at instant speed safely through multiple removal spells. I think 1 archaeomancer is enough as the 4th worse treasure find that can also grab treasure find. I will make the changes to the list.

I don't think Think Twice is necessary, just overdraw your hand and discard Maniac. Or play an Obelisk as a discard outlet, though I'm not sure that would be correct because using TF on it is way too slow. Obviously you lose if you can't keep a Seance on the table but I'm going all-in here.

Personally I think I'm dropping the Think Twice and two Doubling Seasons for three Gravediggers because Crabs are so critical for the deck's speed in the midgame. Once you get that Seance you just want to plow through the deck ASAP.

I agree about Archaeomancer at one copy, there aren't enough spells to justify a second.

can I just say there is nothing more satisfying then seancing a craterhoof against a red agro deck for 92 damage

I think every amount of damage over 92 would be more satisfying.

I mean I think I had another spider spawning in the grave but whatever ¯\\_(ツ)_/¯

also just something thats nagging at me, is it ever correct to seance a visionary, because while it's ETB does sound good you lose a creature in the discard resulting in a weaker spawning, and most of your other creatures can be used to mill yourself most likely giving you a net possitive in the grave

I always thought Seance/Spawning was a nonbo but if you mill fast enough I guess it's okay.

The question in your circumstance would be whether you'd prefer a random card or a 1/2 with reach. Depends on the board and opponent.

Yeah, SP and Seance work against each other. Not a fan.

The point is if you get an early seance and it sticks for 4 or 5 turns you will likely win anyway. If you don't you will need spider spawning to survive or win the game.

That is why we have lab maniac, if plan A (seance) works you will win through self mill and you just generate a handful of spiders to survive. If you don't hit plan A then you move to plan B (spiders) and move on to the swarm plan.

and just one more question if an opening hand (lets assume I haven't mulliganed yet) has laboratory maniac would you throw it back even if it curved well?

No it's fine in hand, you can run it out and block or just over draw and discard it.

mm k

I'm making a new post for this deck because I've featured it on YouTube and I want to be able to link to it from there. The table will reflect any changes made after the recording of the deck tech.

I mentioned it on Hakeem's channel but figured I'd post it here as well.

I've been testing Hakeem's janky pile (his words..not mine!) and added +3 Spider Spawning and +1 Craterhoof Behemoth for -3 Gravedigger and -1 Archaeomancer. Even though Hakeem indicated he was a one trick pony for a win condition, it just seemed like the deck could fit some other ways to win. Both SS and Hoof are extremely easy to recur and SS has the added bonus of gumming up the board (especially the air which this deck could afford to include). I'm just concerned about the Archaeomancer cut since it's another means in which to grab Treasured Find since Seance is a must in this deck. I also enjoyed the odd gravedigger use too but that doesn't hurt as much to lose. Regardless, both SS and Hoof are great fits in this theme and easy wins so it really comes down to what to cut.

elk

Based on testing tonight, the one consideration is a single copy of Resolute Archangel (or something similar to recur). The deck is consistent and with Seance, it's a powerhouse but burn can be an issue.


elk

Hey elk I think we are on the same page

Here is my current list. I don't think wall of omens is needed, you have enough enter the battlefield effects. In those slots I have 1 archaeomancer, 1 grave digger and 1 resolute archangel.

Wall was nice for early chump giving the deck time to set up and it might be better than Visionary in this case (at least Visionary can attack on the Behemoth swing)? Both Wall and Visionary were nice to fix your hand and keep the draw/dump going but making room for the 3 cards that you did are a good call (well archaeomancer and archangel are).

Guess it'll be time for some test spins (although it'll be tough over the next couple days with the move!)


elk

I was chatting with mobius last night and he suggested -1 PC -Demon for 1 Resolute and 1 Spawning. We also chatted a bit about Obelisk and think it's probably worth a spot to pitch cards from hand into the GY for Seance as well as providing a nice life buffer and a bit of spot removal. Gravediggers are some flex slots but I think the deck should have at least one copy.

I think the speed of the mill means we can really pull off the toolbox of singletons though I'm worried about taxing TF. I still want Lab Maniac to be how the deck wins so no Hoofs for me.

Like I said in the YT deck tech I'm testing the deck on camera so it could be a fluid process this week.