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PostPosted: Tue Sep 23, 2014 4:19 pm 
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I've been running the following list to pretty good effect, think its about 85% WR in 1v1. Pretty straight forward control deck, with emphasis on Chasm Skulker and Roil Elemental as Wincons. Contains premium cards but I ran a variant without for a while that did well enough. Lots of draw is nice, and enough counters / bounce / gomozoa's to keep you in the early game. Once you hit 6 mana you want to hold one in hand for Roil Elemental. And you really dont want to be dropping skulker or elemental unless you have some counters in hand as protecting them is key. Starts are generally based around having a ton of removal / counters in hand so you can get going, but you can get off to a hot start with Cloudfins -> Skulker -> Rager -> Gomozoa to get the evolve going and come out swinging.

Really plays more like a blue deck, but i like tribute to hunger and rager a lot, indulgent tormentor is kind of whatever but the potential draw fits the deck nicely and its a decent sized flyer.


Blue:
4 x Cloudfin Raptor
2 x Voidsnare
4 x Think Twice
3 x Nullify
3 x Negate
2 x Chasm Skulker
2 x Dissolve
2 x Guard Gomozoa
2 x Dissolve
2 x Roil Elemental

Black:
4 x Phyrexian Rager
3 x Tribute to Hunger
2 x Indulgent Tormentor

(Maybe a monomania or two)

Multi:
2 x Dinrova Horror


Lands:
14 x Island
7 x Swamps
4 x Dimir Guildgate

Mainly you want to use counters and draw to gain card advantage, slowly build a boardstate with flyers, and eventually just steal to win.


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PostPosted: Sat Sep 27, 2014 1:14 am 
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Here's the bident/deathtouch deck I've been running.

Land

9 x island
7 x swamp
4 x dimir guildgate

Blue

4 x cloudfin raptor
4 x triton shorestalker
4 x voyage's end
4 x think twice
2 x chasm skulker
3 x guard gomazoa
3 x dissolve
2 x bident of thassa

Black

4 x pharika's chosen
4 x giant scorpion

Artifact

2 x elixir of immortality
2 x cobbled wings
2 x creepy doll


Prepare for long games and lots of drawing. Elixirs get cards back but can also get back needed life. Cobbled wings help to make sure you're protected from everything. Sometimes you win 1-2 damage at a time with shorestalkers. Force them into your deathtouch with bident and then attack. Lots of fun.


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PostPosted: Sat Sep 27, 2014 9:13 am 
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I like the idea of using Bident to force creatures into your DT creatures. I don't think I've seen anyone actually put up a build based around that. Looks like a fun build, I might give it a test drive sometime.

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PostPosted: Sun Sep 28, 2014 11:35 am 
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Actually made a few changes. Ditched the cobbled wings and one elixir and added 3 military intelligence. The extra draw really speeds up the deck and makes a big difference. Also took out guildgates for 12 islands and 8 swamps


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PostPosted: Sun Sep 28, 2014 5:48 pm 
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tb113 wrote:
Actually made a few changes. Ditched the cobbled wings and one elixir and added 3 military intelligence. The extra draw really speeds up the deck and makes a big difference. Also took out guildgates for 12 islands and 8 swamps

I was interested to see how the wings work, I never see them in builds but think they may be a little overlooked. Guess they were not really cutting it though. I also agree that usually 1 elixir is enough outside a couple specific builds. I could see military intelligence working well here for sure.

I think it would probably be good to at least keep a couple gates if 4 was a bit too many.

Also, if you make changes to an initial build it is a good idea to edit the original post and at the bottom put something along the lines of "Edit #1: -4 Dimir Guildgates, +# Swamps, +# Islands, -2 Cobbled Wings, -1 Elixir, +3 Military Intelligence" and maybe even a brief description why. It can help to see how and why a deck evolved and sometimes it helps because it wasn't the right choice to make and you have a record of exactly what changed. It is nothing that has to be done, but it is a good practice imo. ;)

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PostPosted: Sun Oct 05, 2014 12:20 am 
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Well, I got a U/B control deck to work. It plays a lot like my Wall of Denial deck, but with black for discard, spot removal, and Dinrova Horrors. Chasm Skulker and Talrand are becoming favorites of mine. They're great in blue based control decks running counterspells.

Thought Drain


I made a very similar deck to this tonight, and had a lot of success. I played maybe 10 games and only lost to goblins. Well, two opponents got sick of my counters, dropped, and then the AI proceeded to kick my ass, but only goblins got legit wins!

My deck has only one (unnecessary) premium card, Dead Reckoning. I chose to use the bigger, slower, win conditions, like Griselbrand and use more stalls with Guard Gomazoa. I played some very slow grindy control games with this deck -- fun stuff. I think Thought Drain is better, with the good Talrand, Sky Summoner and Think Twice synergy, which also work well with the Chasm Skulker win condition. Love that guy!

Controlled Farts

Creatures - 10
2 Chasm Skulker
3 Guard Gomazoa
1 Roil Elemental
1 Rune-Scarred Demon
1 Griselbrand
2 Dinrova Horror

Other Spells - 26
1 Ulcerate
2 Voyage's End
3 Negate
4 Nullify
3 Dissolve
1 Counterlash
2 Mind Rot
4 Inspiration
1 Dead Reckoning
1 Rescue from the Underworld
4 Flesh to Dust

Land - 24
4 Dimir Guildgate
12 Island
8 Swamp

I think my choice of Counterlash and Dead Reckoning are both a bit sub-optimal. There's possibly some other not so great cards in there. I was using Niblis of the Breath because I thought the ability to lock down a creature would be sweet, but I found they died way too easily to 1 point of damage from red decks. The Talrand, Sky Summoner and Think Twice really add a lot of tempo to this deck, and I think your version is better -- maybe I'll pick up those premium packs and kick those goblin decks to the curb.


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 11, 2014 6:07 am 
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[manapie 90 -w u b -r -g][/manapie]

Cold Death

A one vs. one deck for Magic 2015.

60 Cards (22 :creature: , 14 :instant: , 24 :land:)

Creature22 cards
■■■
Brain Maggot1/1
■■■■
Frost Lynx2/2
■■■■
Liliana's Specter2/1
■■■■
Phyrexian Rager2/2
Shadowborn Demon5/6
■■■
Dinrova Horror4/4
■■
Rune-Scarred Demon6/6
Sheoldred, Whispering One6/6
Spell14 cards
■■■■
Undying Evil
■■■■
Think Twice
■■■■
Voyage's End
■■
Rescue from the Underworld
Land24 cards
■■■■
Dimir Guildgate
8
Island
12
Swamp


I had the idea for this one after playing Prune's build which I liked a lot, although I found that a few cards were a little too under performing for my taste in this setup (mainly Agent of the Fates and Tribute to Hunger). So I tweaked it to focus more solely on creatures with ETB effects and ways to have them come into play more often, which resulted in this build.

With a lot of creatures costing 3CMC or more, this deck's winning strategy is centered around mid-late game beatdown. In the first rounds you want to build card advantage using Think Twice and Phyrexian Rager and then start annoying your opponent with the above-mentioned Ragers as well as Liliana's Specter and Frost Lynx. With Undying Evil and Voyage's End you shouldn't be afraid to see your creatures dying. It's OK to have some creatures die anyway, and you'll still have opportunities way to bring them back in the later game.

Brain Maggot is also a great early play, allows you to get a look at your opponent's hand and take whichever card you want. The synergy with Voyage's End and Undying Evil here is obvious, as you can save it for removal and take another peek at their hand in one shot when they decide to get their card back later.

Until you get more lands in play, you goal will then be to exhaust your opponent's removal and creatures on your early guys while you continue building card advantage and/or making him lose cards and/or harassing him with hard to block creatures thanks to flying or Frost Lynx opening the way.

The fun really begins when you start having around 6~7 lands in play. If you managed to have your opponent use many of his options during the earlier phase of the game, then he should really have a hard time to deal with what's coming next. Dinrova Horror, Rune-Scarred Demon and Shadowborn Demon all have godly ETB effects. Add to this the wonderful Rescue from the Underworld as a way to have two ETB effects activated at the same time (and possibly save one of your guys), and there is not much your opponent will be able to do when you get the party going (sucks to have this spell countered though, haha). Sheodred, Whispering One is pretty much autowin in the later game, takes care of your opponent's creatures and also brings your ETB creatures back. Undying Evil and Voyage's End remain cheap ways to save your big guys and reactivate their ETBs in the late game as well, so it's always a good idea to leave mana open for them when you cast a big creature.

2014/10/12 Edit: Swapped one Mercurial Pretender for a Swamp for a slightly better land distribution.

2014/11/02 Edit: Removed one Quickling and added another Swamp for better mana consistency. Deck should run fine mana-wise now.

2015/03/14 Edit: Change to fit in new cards. -1 Island +1 Swamp, -2 Quickling, -1 Mercurial Pretender, -1 Rescue from the Underworld, +3 Brain Maggot, +1 Sheodred, Whispering One

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Last edited by Dream Maker on Sat Mar 14, 2015 11:07 pm, edited 5 times in total.

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PostPosted: Sat Oct 11, 2014 9:21 am 
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22 land seems a little low for this deck (especially since Mercurial Pretender shines at 9 mana). Perhaps you could cut some Think Twice for some land.
I agree on it being pretty vulnerable to aggro no matter what, but it does seem like a fun deck!


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 11, 2014 12:02 pm 
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Aranthys wrote:
For B/U, I build it as a pretty straightforward Control deck.
Contains premium cards, but a non-premium deck can easily be made too :
Pharika's Chosen => Dead Weight or Assassinate
Think Twice => Inspiration
Soul of Ravnica => Mahamoti Djinn

The only card I kinda question is the single elixir, since I hardly need it, but...

Game plan is pretty easy : Stall / Counter until you can bring out the big boys.

Control + Big Flyers :
Island x12
Swamp x8
Dimir Guildgate x4

Elixir of Immortality x1
Ulcerate x3
Pharika's Chosen x4
Think Twice x4
Nullify x4
Dissolve x3
Tribute to Hunger x3
Archaeomancer x4
Flesh to Dust x2
Time Warp x1
Mahamoti Djinn x1
Soul of Ravnica x1
Counterlash x2
Rune-Scarred Demon x2
Griselbrand x1


Now that the meta isn't flooded with tokens any longer, this deck that was posted near the beginning is TONS of FUN! Love counter magic :D

I just swapped out the elixer for Kozie and this deck is awesome.

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PostPosted: Sat Oct 11, 2014 10:15 pm 
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Left4Doner wrote:
22 land seems a little low for this deck (especially since Mercurial Pretender shines at 9 mana). Perhaps you could cut some Think Twice for some land.
I agree on it being pretty vulnerable to aggro no matter what, but it does seem like a fun deck!


Thanks, I guess this confirms what I was thinking about the land count! I'm a bit wary about cutting think twice though considering it's pretty much the only card I can play at 2CMC at the beginning of the game, so I think it's crucial to get a good start which is why I need 4 in the deck.

You have your point on the pretender though, I didn't see him as a 9CMC card in effect. I decided to leave him to a 1-of considering he will really shine in late game, and I can still tutor it with Rune-Scarred in case I need him. Swapped the 2nd one for a 10th Swamp considering the higher number of cards having in their cost.

I don't know if it's luck considering it's just one more land, but with this change the deck has been running a bit more smoothly, slightly less land droughts and I have been able to get Liliana's specter on turn 3 more often.

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PostPosted: Sun Oct 12, 2014 4:50 am 
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I would cut a Quickling to sneak in that 24th land; I like the card but you can't play it until turn four so drawing multiples can be pretty bad. Trust me, I've the card in a bunch of decks and three copies is only good if you have a bunch of one-drops.

Once you get to 24 land you can probably consider Griselbrand over one copy of Rescue from the Underworld. Rescue is good, but running three gets you into the same bind as Quickling and that's drawing them too early and in multiples.

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PostPosted: Tue Oct 14, 2014 11:42 am 
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Hakeem928 wrote:
I would cut a Quickling to sneak in that 24th land; I like the card but you can't play it until turn four so drawing multiples can be pretty bad. Trust me, I've the card in a bunch of decks and three copies is only good if you have a bunch of one-drops.

Once you get to 24 land you can probably consider Griselbrand over one copy of Rescue from the Underworld. Rescue is good, but running three gets you into the same bind as Quickling and that's drawing them too early and in multiples.

No.

1. There is no reason to add a 24th land unless you prescribe to the dogmatic view of "every deck must have 24 lands".
2. Drop a quickling and wonder why you never draw them anymore, or do so too seldom
3. The reason to use 3 copies of Rescue is due to the fact they can also go to the graveyard via self mill. You're increasing your chances of actually having one in hand at some point by having 3.

I also agree that having too many token decks around kind of crippled Dimir's chances at being run at all. The same with Simic Bounce.

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If You get an aggro player to stop attacking, you've got the match won.


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 14, 2014 11:55 am 
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(1) You call it "dogma", I call it "being able to cast spells". This deck contains 10 cards at 5+ mana and I suggested adding an 8-drop, so I think 24 land is a safe minimum. 25 would be preferable to 23 here but Think Twice and Phyrexian Ragers help with land-drop consistency so 24 should work.

(2) Including less copies of a creature does mean that you will draw it less. This applies to land as well, see (1) above.

(3) This deck doesn't contain any self-mill, so the fact that you don't even know that proves you haven't looked at the decklist thoroughly enough for your advice to be of any value.

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Last edited by Hakeem928 on Tue Oct 14, 2014 2:21 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Tue Oct 14, 2014 1:57 pm 
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I think the deck could use 25 land, like Hakeem said you can get away with 24 but in my mind 25 is better as you need to hit your first 5 or 6 land drops.

I don't like 3 quickling without any 1 drops as it is uncastable until turn 4. I could see running 1 or max 2.

In a deck with no self mill I would run 1 rescue from the underworld at most. You already have undying evil and bounce to abuse etb effects. Rescue is good to cheat things into play that you have milled but I like 1 for value in these sorts of decks. It plays a similar role to pretender.

I could see cutting 1 quickling and 2 rescue for 2 land and Griselbrand.


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 14, 2014 3:41 pm 
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Hakeem928 wrote:
(1) You call it "dogma", I call it "being able to cast spells". This deck contains 10 cards at 5+ mana and I suggested adding an 8-drop, so I think 24 land is a safe minimum. 25 would be preferable to 23 here but Think Twice and Phyrexian Ragers help with land-drop consistency so 24 should work.

(2) Including less copies of a creature does mean that you will draw it less. This applies to land as well, see (1) above.

(3) This deck doesn't contain any self-mill, so the fact that you don't even know that proves you haven't looked at the decklist thoroughly enough for your advice to be of any value.

1. I tried the deck at 23, it had no problems "casting spells". I also tried it at 25, it had a problem "drawing spells" instead of land. I swear, one match it drew land 10 turns in a row.
2. Yes, it does. By including more copies of a spell, you increase the likelihood of drawing said spell. That's 101 stuff. He's using Quickling to redo ETB effects, not replacing one drops with a 2/2 flyer.
3. I was using that as a reference if you had bothered to think about it. Dropping a Rescue will decrease the deck's ability to draw said spell. If I was forced to drop a Rescue though, I'd replace it with a Switcheroo due to having quite a few creatures that can easily be replaced for something of higher value of an opponent's.

Also however, if he wants to run Griselbrand, add one land, drop 1 Dinrova Horror and one rescue.

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If You get an aggro player to stop attacking, you've got the match won.


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 14, 2014 4:01 pm 
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How did you topdeck 10 lands in a row without dying first? Can you give me a breakdown of the match, what deck your opponent was playing, what spells you cast, and who eventually won?

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PostPosted: Tue Oct 14, 2014 4:06 pm 
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The big problem with quickling and rescue is drawing multiples early. You need a creature in play for quickling which cannot happen until you untap on turn 4 and that's if the creature lives. Rescue is very average at re using etb's unless it brings a good threat back too.

You will not hit your first 5 land drops consistently with 23 land. Yes you will get to 3 mana and you have a lot of 3 drops but not playing your bigger threats until turn 9 or 10 will definitely cost you games. Where as playing with 25 land has a marginal downside because a deck like this which draws a lot of cards will rarely run out of gas.

You would much rather have a couple of extra land and play all of your spells than lose with 4 cards in hand because you were constrained on mana.


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 15, 2014 10:54 am 
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[manapie 90 -w u b -r -g][/manapie]

The Abyss

A one vs. one deck for Magic 2015.

60 Cards (23 :creature: , 13 :instant: , 24 :land:)

Cost 3 cards
■■■
Ulcerate
Cost 8 cards
■■■■
Maritime Guard1/3
■■■■
Think Twice
Cost 13 cards
■■
Chasm Skulker1/1
■■■■
Liliana's Specter2/1
■■■■
Phyrexian Rager2/2
■■■
Tribute to Hunger
Cost 1 card
Jalira, Master Polymorphist2/2
Cost 5 cards
■■
Mercurial Pretender0/0
Shadowborn Demon5/6
■■
Switcheroo
Cost 3 cards
■■■
Dinrova Horror4/4
Cost 2 cards
■■
Rune-Scarred Demon6/6
Cost 1 card
■■
Suffer the Past
Land24 cards
12
Island
12
Swamp



It started out as a deck to use fun cards like Switcheroo but after a million tweaks, I feel I stumbled on something really strong. Went 16-3 last night (this proves nothing other than it's at least not a complete dud).

The Maritime Guards seem weak but they do their job well. They stop 1/1s and block 2/2s. They also make perfect fodder later for Switcheroo, Jailira and Shadowborn.

Suffer the past is often fetched by a Rune-Scarred Demon to end the game next turn so I don't mind having just 1.

The deck isn't tailored for Chasm Skulker but I feel this deck has enough draw to make him big enough, quickly enough. His squid tokens are useful fodder as well. It's risky to give an islandwalker to your opponent with a Switcheroo though :(

The ideal end game is a Dinrova Horror being recurred over and over by a mercurial pretender to the point where your bounce/discarding even his lands. Most of the time, the game ends up with a relatively clear board and you're just waiting for your opponent to come up with a game-ending creature that you'll just steal or sacrifice or bounce or kill... This deck takes a lot of patience: you and your opponent are both going to end up sinking deep into the abyss. Only, you can hold your breath for a looong time.


Last edited by Backhorn on Wed Oct 15, 2014 11:44 am, edited 2 times in total.

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 15, 2014 11:10 am 
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That looks really solid Backhorn. When I first saw Maritime Guard I was like "oh geeze, those are worthless" but as I continued down the list with Jalira & Switcheroos it made a lot more sense, and as you state they are good early defense. I also think a couple gates would be nice as well to make sure you can drop specter on T3. It might work fine without the gates though, I don't see a whole lot of need for them tbh but a couple is usually a good idea.

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 15, 2014 11:40 am 
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Nebula wrote:
That looks really solid Backhorn. When I first saw Maritime Guard I was like "oh geeze, those are worthless" but as I continued down the list with Jalira & Switcheroos it made a lot more sense, and as you state they are good early defense. I also think a couple gates would be nice as well to make sure you can drop specter on T3. It might work fine without the gates though, I don't see a whole lot of need for them tbh but a couple is usually a good idea.


Heck I thought they were worthless too before. Whenever I saw someone use them I thought to myself, "look at this noob with his vanilla 1/3". But the noobness was inside me all along.

The gates are definitely something to think about. So far there hasn't been enough color-screwed moments to risk not being able to cast Dinrova Horror on turn 6 or flashback a Think Twice because the land you drew was a gate. The Specters are indeed the worst offenders and the only reason I'd consider gates. Or maybe I should replace the Specters with Guard Gomazoa? I do love how the specters interact with Mercurial Pretender and Dinrova Horror though...


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