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PostPosted: Wed May 10, 2017 4:30 pm 
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Haven't played since I wrapped up Eldritch Moon set. Got a bit of Kaladesh after and got bored. Now I have almost no Aether Revolt, and have been working on Amonkhet. I liked the counterspells and zombie cards from Amon and it got me interested again.

Unfortunately I'm getting facerolled by vehicle decks. They are absurdly fast. I had a nice Simic counter/ramp deck worked out that I liked, but it's too slow w/o these 2 mana counters; switched to a Gruul ramp/aggro deck that used to work and Golgari Delirium but it's all still too slow most of the time. The rogue copter is absurd and can be piloted by anything. I guess I need to learn to wait with my removal until it's manned? I seem to remember that just killing the crew, though. I guess there must me way more artifact or "permanent" removal in the sets I don't have? Seems like the aggro creatures got vamped up yet again as well with exert.

Anyway the question is;

Are any of you running decks that work well against these vehicles? (That aren't vehicle based) And if so; what are they? Also should I forget Amonkhet and focus on AetherRevolt or Kaladesh?

Thanks


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PostPosted: Wed May 10, 2017 4:52 pm 
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Any turbo fog variant is basically an auto win vs vehicles.(fog mill, fog tower, eflingma drake)
besides that mono green crushes it fairly hard, I just included my own vehicles and a few extra reach creatures.(basically any G/x deck will do fine)


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PostPosted: Wed May 10, 2017 5:02 pm 
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You can attrition vehicle decks pretty well, but you put yourself in a position where creatureless decks will dominate you. Black and white have nice options.

e.g. Black: Fatal Push, Grasp of Darkness, Murder make for decent removal for the vehicles. Kalitas, Traitor of Ghet and Complete Disregard can take care of the Scrapheap Scroungers.

White has some decent artifact hate and exile creature effects too. Personally my go to for facing vehicles is an Abzan deck with a ton of removal, 3 sages, some unmakings and a few bombs. It just attritions them out and topdecks much better than they can.

Another deck that can work well has been gruul aggro, if you go first you can just out-tempo them. Doesn't feel as inevitable as Abzan though since you don't really interact with their cards.


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PostPosted: Thu May 11, 2017 10:12 am 
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Vehicles are disturbingly efficient, resilient and versatile yes. Mardu vehicles is still the top dog. You just have to deal with it until and if wizards does something about them.
I dont know how those fog decks and such can win against properly but maybe I'm missing something.
If you want to beat them maindeck reclamation sages. Multiple of the top 8 decks last tourney ran multiple rec sages and that made difference


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PostPosted: Thu May 11, 2017 10:23 am 
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Joly wrote:
Vehicles are disturbingly efficient, resilient and versatile yes. Mardu vehicles is still the top dog. You just have to deal with it until and if wizards does something about them.
I dont know how those fog decks and such can win against properly but maybe I'm missing something.
If you want to beat them maindeck reclamation sages. Multiple of the top 8 decks last tourney ran multiple rec sages and that made difference


Because they can't damage you and you either just mill them out too fast or kill them in 1 shot with a flinged drake.(depending on the build)
I don't see how you lose to them the only real "burn" most of them run is disintigration which does next to nothing against you.
I've lost 1 game to vehicles while on turbo fog/eflingma drake and that was on a mull to 5 on the draw while they had their nut hand.

But yeah rec sage is good, creeping mold is good too if you're a mono green ramp deck(both can be played)
i've had them rage quit t3 creeping molding a land and mana screwing them lol.(works better vs the mardu version than rw


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PostPosted: Thu May 11, 2017 10:59 am 
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Joly wrote:
Vehicles are disturbingly efficient, resilient and versatile yes. Mardu vehicles is still the top dog. You just have to deal with it until and if wizards does something about them.
I dont know how those fog decks and such can win against properly but maybe I'm missing something.
If you want to beat them maindeck reclamation sages. Multiple of the top 8 decks last tourney ran multiple rec sages and that made difference


Because they can't damage you and you either just mill them out too fast or kill them in 1 shot with a flinged drake.(depending on the build)
I don't see how you lose to them the only real "burn" most of them run is disintigration which does next to nothing against you.
I've lost 1 game to vehicles while on turbo fog/eflingma drake and that was on a mull to 5 on the draw while they had their nut hand.

But yeah rec sage is good, creeping mold is good too if you're a mono green ramp deck(both can be played)
i've had them rage quit t3 creeping molding a land and mana screwing them lol.(works better vs the mardu version than rw

Vehicles has a really fast clock, easily killing you on t5 with an average draw. Having to chain so many fogs, while having the tutelage deployed and having enough card draw to sustain, so early is not super easy. They also play Balista and cut/ribbons for some extra reach and have walkers like nahiri and chandra to put you in a very weird position


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PostPosted: Thu May 11, 2017 11:51 am 
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Joly wrote:
Joly wrote:
Vehicles are disturbingly efficient, resilient and versatile yes. Mardu vehicles is still the top dog. You just have to deal with it until and if wizards does something about them.
I dont know how those fog decks and such can win against properly but maybe I'm missing something.
If you want to beat them maindeck reclamation sages. Multiple of the top 8 decks last tourney ran multiple rec sages and that made difference


Because they can't damage you and you either just mill them out too fast or kill them in 1 shot with a flinged drake.(depending on the build)
I don't see how you lose to them the only real "burn" most of them run is disintigration which does next to nothing against you.
I've lost 1 game to vehicles while on turbo fog/eflingma drake and that was on a mull to 5 on the draw while they had their nut hand.

But yeah rec sage is good, creeping mold is good too if you're a mono green ramp deck(both can be played)
i've had them rage quit t3 creeping molding a land and mana screwing them lol.(works better vs the mardu version than rw

Vehicles has a really fast clock, easily killing you on t5 with an average draw. Having to chain so many fogs, while having the tutelage deployed and having enough card draw to sustain, so early is not super easy. They also play Balista and cut/ribbons for some extra reach and have walkers like nahiri and chandra to put you in a very weird position


Between tutelage, fevered visions bounty(some lists) and all the draw spells you play with tutelage it's really not hard to fog every turn, also pulse makes it so you don't need to fog every turn early on.

I have yet to see a vehicles deck play cut//ribbons, normally just push, dec, anguish, skywhalers, harnessed etc.

as for the walkers, you end up playing pulse which can normally kill you out of range of dying to chandra.
Nahiri isn't really an issue unless they have the 1x ula(but i have NEVER had vehicles drop nahiri on me, lilly, gid or chandra)
i'm sure there are some different lists out there but ribbons is at it's best in jund or a control deck.

Balista doesn't tend to be too scary, a point or two of damage here or there isn't anything to really fret over most games.
(don't get me wrong, i'm sure on the draw against a nut hand could very well beat fog, I have just only faced their nut draw vs fog with me being on the play. so i'm not sure how bad that really is.)

I have put in over 100 games now strictly on fog varients and superfriends and vehicles are honestly an match up, hell i've won through tamiyo ults and the jace ult that counters the first spell cast each turn


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