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 Post subject: Top Tier Decks?
PostPosted: Sun Jan 22, 2017 2:03 pm 
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What decks have you found with the highest win ratios? Please include decklists if possible.


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 Post subject: Re: Top Tier Decks?
PostPosted: Sun Jan 22, 2017 2:21 pm 
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It's a little early to tell. Browse through the constructed deck dub forum and read what people are saying about their decks. You gotta do a little work.

You can also watch CovertGoBlues Twitch. He plays really good decks that he play tests a ton.


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 Post subject: Re: Top Tier Decks?
PostPosted: Sun Jan 22, 2017 2:24 pm 
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A high win ratio depends far more on the skill of the player and how familiar they are with Magic than the cards in the deck.

For example, people have told me that Elves lose badly to Vehicles. My new Elf deck has gone 20-1 (that's 20 wins and 1 loss, not 20 losses and 1 win) despite certain board members slamming it.

I have a 5-color Ally deck with a win ratio of at least 75-80%. Despite people on this board telling me that's impossible and it's a deck that can't win.

Bottom line, a LOT of posters on here think they can look at a decklist and determine whether it will perform well without even testing it. In the 500 hours I've played this iteration of Duels, I have found it to be the overwhelming case that player skill can make MOST - not ALL, of course - but MOST decks can have a win ratio of at least 50%. And as I said, all the ones I've made have been in the 70% range or higher.

I even made a mono-Blue 100 card deck as a joke. It is currently undefeated.

This is not to say I'm perfect or the best wizard poker player in the world; if anything, it's more that so many people on Steam are so bad at the game, but I'm not going to discount the fact that I've been playing Magic off and on since Arabian Nights.

For content, here is my current favorite deck to pilot. It is currently undefeated after about 20 games, except for a game where I got badly land locked.

2 x Fatal Push
2 x Baral, Chief of Compliance
2 x Scrapheap Scrounger
1 x Heart of Kiran
2 x Smuggler's Copter
2 x Telling Time
2 x Trophy Mage
2 x Weldfast Engineer
2 x Chief of the Foundry
1 x Foundry Inspector
2 x Aethersphere Harvester
3 x Metallic Rebuke
2 x Read the Bones
1 x Liliana, the Last Hope
1 x Saheeli Rai
1 x Untethered Express
2 x Yahenni's Expertise
1 x Tezzeret the Schemer
1 x Skysovereign, Consul Flagship
2 x Reverse Engineer
1 x Noxious Gearhulk
1 x Herald of Anguish

6 x Island
5 x Swamp
2 x Smoldering Marsh
2 x Sunken Hollow
2 x Drowned Catacomb
2 x Sulfur Falls
2 x Inventors' Fair
1 x Foundry of the Consuls
1 x Aether Hub


Enjoy!


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 Post subject: Re: Top Tier Decks?
PostPosted: Sun Jan 22, 2017 2:28 pm 
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Before you all jump on me, let me do it for you:

"You're not running enough lands. Why so many 1-ofs? That deck is terrible. It will get eaten alive. You're lying about your win ratio."

I'm not lying, of course. This board has a real problem with decks they think should do badly, to the point that they will dismiss actual gameplay evidence in favor of Magic Theory.


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 Post subject: Re: Top Tier Decks?
PostPosted: Sun Jan 22, 2017 2:48 pm 
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This board has a lot of experienced players

I wonder if the OP was looking to get a speech. :)

I'm not sure you can say a deck is undefeated except getting land locked once. I don't know if the manabase is optimal or not but it's worth considering.

Anyway is this your best deck Mythic ? I could take it for a spin if you want. Looks fun


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 Post subject: Re: Top Tier Decks?
PostPosted: Sun Jan 22, 2017 2:52 pm 
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@ Mythic: Your testimony does not equal evidence. Video is evidence. Put it on YouTube or Twitch, show us all and I'll eat my words, right here on the forum, in front of everyone.

As far as top tier decks go.. it's still too soon. No one has cracked the meta, and I don't think you'll find a deck that's invincible. Everything has a hard counter.

Legend's superfriends deck he posted Friday is really good.. but it does to counter spam.

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 Post subject: Re: Top Tier Decks?
PostPosted: Sun Jan 22, 2017 2:57 pm 
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"You're not running enough lands. Why so many 1-ofs? That deck is terrible. It will get eaten alive. You're lying about your win ratio."

I couldn't have said it better myself :thumbsup:

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 Post subject: Re: Top Tier Decks?
PostPosted: Sun Jan 22, 2017 3:12 pm 
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While the OP's request, as well as Mythics response, might be looked upon as "i want a deck to netdeck, now", i think there is a serious and real point behind it: these forums (as well as duelshelper) have been very quiet this time around regarding new decks by experienced players. It's not just about netdecking, i'm very rarely building decks from scratch (well, in simpler games like Hearthstone and Gwent, not here) and enjoy taking out ideas where a lot of thought got into and trying to improve on them to the best of my abilities. This time around it gets pretty hard, i liked it more when the people thinking about new effective decks were allowing us to participate in the thought process earlier on, not just waiting for the opening of the tournament registrations.


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 Post subject: Re: Top Tier Decks?
PostPosted: Sun Jan 22, 2017 3:16 pm 
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Some likely-to-be-effective decks have been posted in constructed, but tbf, this is a mini set, consequently it's not going to shake up the meta that much (at least not right away).


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 Post subject: Re: Top Tier Decks?
PostPosted: Sun Jan 22, 2017 3:20 pm 
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Nathaniel wrote:
This time around it gets pretty hard, i liked it more when the people thinking about new effective decks were allowing us to participate in the thought process earlier on, not just waiting for the opening of the tournament registrations.


:cookie:

You win NGA for today with this part alone. I mentioned it before I took my break in KLD how the deck posts by the seasoned guys dropped off, Modulo and the occasional brew by Gemini were the only ones holding the fort.

As far as my end goes, a lot of the brews I was looking forward to in AER just suck in the current grind environment. Too many aggro decks means UB Artifacts falls flat, for example. We'll see if this SCG thing can spark a bit more creativity (Esper aggro), but I agree that the "secrecy" nonsense regarding "tournament tech" leaves it a little barren. DJ is back though, and he has a fairly unique way of looking at brewing, I always like trying his decks even they end up as unplayable jank :p

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 Post subject: Re: Top Tier Decks?
PostPosted: Sun Jan 22, 2017 3:29 pm 
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Maybe my counting is off, but I'm counting 59 cards? Is that right?


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 Post subject: Re: Top Tier Decks?
PostPosted: Sun Jan 22, 2017 3:32 pm 
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So I can actually be of some use in this thread and contribute to the OP's request

This is the main deck I have been playing so far this season and its been really impressive to me. Not many new flashy cards but Hungry Flames and Shock are very instrumental to the success of this deck.

UR Alchemy

Creature(12)
4 x Thermo-Alchemist
2 x Abbot of Keral Keep
3 x Stormchaser Mage
1 x Jace, Vryn's Prodigy
2 x Bedlam Reveler

Instant(14)
3 x Lightning Axe
4 x Shock
4 x Fiery Temper
3 x Hungry Flames

Sorcery(8)
4 x Take Inventory
2 x Exquisite Firecraft
2 x Collective Defiance

Enchantment(2)
2 x Fevered Visions

Planeswalker(1)
1 x Chandra, Torch of Defiance

Land(23)
2 x Wandering Fumarole
8 x Island
10 x Mountain
2 x Sulfur Falls
1 x Geier Reach Sanitarium

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 Post subject: Re: Top Tier Decks?
PostPosted: Sun Jan 22, 2017 3:41 pm 
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I like it WeCo.

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 Post subject: Re: Top Tier Decks?
PostPosted: Sun Jan 22, 2017 3:42 pm 
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They are always unplayable jank, BBB, that's why they are fun. ;)


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 Post subject: Re: Top Tier Decks?
PostPosted: Sun Jan 22, 2017 3:46 pm 
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Nathaniel wrote:
While the OP's request, as well as Mythics response, might be looked upon as "i want a deck to netdeck, now", i think there is a serious and real point behind it: these forums (as well as duelshelper) have been very quiet this time around regarding new decks by experienced players. It's not just about netdecking, i'm very rarely building decks from scratch (well, in simpler games like Hearthstone and Gwent, not here) and enjoy taking out ideas where a lot of thought got into and trying to improve on them to the best of my abilities. This time around it gets pretty hard, i liked it more when the people thinking about new effective decks were allowing us to participate in the thought process earlier on, not just waiting for the opening of the tournament registrations.


This should be a good introduction to how Magic works then. This is basically how things tend to work out in paper Magic. When new sets release the majority of the player base usually end up playing decks that were good in the previous season with a few updates from the new set (this is particularly the case with small sets). This happens until a few tournaments happen and a few breakout "fringe" decks emerge, at which point they get picked up on and become more common in the meta, at which point more decks emerge to counter them or capitalize on an unoccupied spot in the meta.

In most cases the decks that see the most play when new sets are released are updated versions of the previously dominant decks. Outside of this, there are usually a few decks that the Devs push on us via set mechanics and R&D decisions.

:r::g: Energy decks are a good example of this. When KLD was released the basic skeleton of the deck was there, and relatively easy to put together yourself if you have some skill in evaluating cards and/or follow the "clues" that R&D give as to what works with what. (Hey, there are a bunch of good cards in :r: and :g: that use or generate Energy, maybe I should make a deck out of this). This deck did well during KLD, so saw a good amount of play among the population.

Now AER is released, and we got some new cards that could potentially slot into this deck. The basic skeleton of the deck (which we know works because of its competence last season) is the same, but we add in a few of the new cards here or there and test them until we find out what works best. The portion of the population playing this deck will remain relatively high, due to its proven effectiveness in the previous season, as well as the influx of people testing out changes and updates to the deck. This continues until either the cards needed to make the deck work are gone (rotation/banning), the deck becomes a bad meta call, or people just generally lose interest. At which the process starts all over again.

This is, in a sense, the evolution of every deck that gets built.

Some deck ideas are much less obvious than others, and as such don't show up until after major tournaments (that secret tech) or don't ever show up on a mainstream level at all (lack of communication, bad meta calls, or just overall janky decks).

It should also be noted that predictions before testing can be accurate, but should in no way be relied upon. Even some decks that are heavily pushed (both by R&D and by general hype) ended up only being decent at best ( that Bant Humans hype) and ones that no one expected at all have done very well on the tournament scene (lets be honest, who predicted Delerium).

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 Post subject: Re: Top Tier Decks?
PostPosted: Sun Jan 22, 2017 3:52 pm 
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Just got to rank 40 with this deck that I put together:

Creatures:
2x Walking Ballista
2x Glint-Sleeve Siphoner
2x Sylvan Advocate
3x Longtusk Cub
3x Winding Constrictor
2x Yahenni, Undying Partisan
2x Tireless Tracker
2x Reclamation Sage
3x Thriving Rhino
2x Aethersphere Harvester
1x Kalitas, Traitor of Ghet
2x Bristling Hydra
2x Armorcraft Judge
1x Verdurous Gearhulk

Instants:
3x Fatal Push

Planeswalkers:
1x Liliana, the Last Hope
1x Nissa, Voice of Zendikar
1x Ob Nixilis Reignited
1x Nissa, Vital Force

Lands:
6x Swamp
7x Forest
2x Hissing Quagmire
2x Woodland Cemetery
3x Aether Hub
4x Evolving Wilds

Entire deck is built mostly around Winding Constrictor, and it really takes over the game if left unchecked. One thing people don't notice is that the snake also gives you additional energy counter each time you gain energy, so it works really great together with energy cards.
Also, Walking Ballista is my favourite new card of the set now, I never had high hopes for it, but it turned out to be a very versatile and syngystic card.


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 Post subject: Re: Top Tier Decks?
PostPosted: Sun Jan 22, 2017 5:01 pm 
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This board has a real problem with decks they think should do badly, to the point that they will dismiss actual gameplay evidence in favor of Magic Theory.

I wasn't aware that anecdotes count as "evidence" now.

Maybe you should walk the walk before talking the talk and actually provide real evidence


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 Post subject: Re: Top Tier Decks?
PostPosted: Sun Jan 22, 2017 6:05 pm 
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Decks I have seen most @ 40

Superfriends. Heart and new PWs seem to help a fair amount.

Cars, mainly RW but some other variations.

G/Colorless Kinda rampy. Played the deck 4-5 times in a row swapping ranks back and forth.

RDW or RB Aggro

And my own Bant

Several other one offs, but those are the main ones I have seen at 40 so far that have seemed pretty good. Also seen a fair amount of Esper on the way up, and other tapout control decks w/ black. I played vs Fel's U/B artifact deck on the way up and Woodland played one also around high 30's, so I think that will be a thing.

I have not seen a single tutelage deck, nor a Spells deck for quite a while. Some mono white up to maybe 30's.

That is all I can think of. So far the worst my deck has gone was 50% vs other archtypes, so feeling pretty good with the current build.

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 Post subject: Re: Top Tier Decks?
PostPosted: Sun Jan 22, 2017 6:07 pm 
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donmolu wrote:
Just got to rank 40 with this deck that I put together:


That is a deck I have not played against, but looked like it may have promise from the card pool. Looks like you have a good working version. What is it good vs and bad vs?

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 Post subject: Re: Top Tier Decks?
PostPosted: Sun Jan 22, 2017 6:22 pm 
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I'll +1 WeCo's list for week 1. Undefeated so far with it. It's just so very very reliable at what it does. AVERAGE t6 kill you, screw your boardstate. It was good last season (despite 90% of the denizens not taking it seriously before it mae waves at a pro tour) but shock and hungry flames helped.


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