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PostPosted: Tue Jan 24, 2017 9:13 am 
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Mold is clearly a bad card. It's a 4-mana sorcery-speed card that does nothing against the creatures already on the board. I don't get why anyone would run it. Aggro decks are perfectly capable of threatening lethal (or effectively lethal) by turn 4. You could slow midrange or control decks down a bit, but by how much? You're investing four mana and a card to get rid of a card they spent zero mana to play. You do end up with a mana advantage, but for the same reason that Explosive Vegetation is not always playable on turn 4, you might not be able to play Mold either.

The only way Mold can conceivably be good is if you're on the play and had a T2 mana dork into T3 Mold, but I doubt that happens often enough to redeem the fact that Mold is otherwise an overpriced Reclamation Sage that doesn't leave a body.


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 24, 2017 2:04 pm 
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Vert: It's not a better LD card than many cards, it's not a better hate card than many cards, but it's one card that can do both. It gives me an additional option.


A card that does two things badly isn't a good card. You're confusing the card being flexible with it being good.

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PostPosted: Tue Jan 24, 2017 2:09 pm 
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butete09 wrote:
Mold would be a threat if another LD card arrives besides Into the Maw of Hell (which no one uses) arrives. Also think LD should be returned in the next set or two. We have a healthy set of cards unlike before so the meta can deal with the threat.


Sure, Demolish sometimes saw play in old UR Vore decks, but those already played Boomerang, Eye of Nowhere, Stone Rain, etc. to basically destroy land all the way up the curve. And it was the worst card in the deck. Even at it's best, Creeping Mold is just a mediocre tempo play.

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PostPosted: Tue Jan 24, 2017 3:21 pm 
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I played Mold in a Mono Green Stampeding Wildebeests deck during Visions. At that time there were no Sages (Just the Monkey) and I think the other option for dealing w/ Enchantments was Naturalize? I played it for the versatility vs Naturalize (Or whatever instant we had at the time) for the decks that didn't have targets. I remember it being decent at the time, but if we had Sage, I don't think I would have touched Mold. Also, back then I remember less options to go into other colors, so removing a color could have a slightly higher impact then currently.

If 4CW became big, or something else that had a shakey mana base it could become a decent meta call, but with agro supreme, it is hard to justify the 4mc

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PostPosted: Tue Jan 24, 2017 5:20 pm 
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LOL going to be removed? Uhhh okay LOL. I have literally NO idea why. Definitely doubting the OP's skill level at this point.


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 24, 2017 5:27 pm 
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Wintervoid wrote:
I played Mold in a Mono Green Stampeding Wildebeests deck during Visions. At that time there were no Sages (Just the Monkey) and I think the other option for dealing w/ Enchantments was Naturalize? I played it for the versatility vs Naturalize (Or whatever instant we had at the time) for the decks that didn't have targets. I remember it being decent at the time, but if we had Sage, I don't think I would have touched Mold. Also, back then I remember less options to go into other colors, so removing a color could have a slightly higher impact then currently.

If 4CW became big, or something else that had a shakey mana base it could become a decent meta call, but with agro supreme, it is hard to justify the 4mc


Did you have a sideboard? Because Naturalize is an amazing sideboard card and neither are really main deck worthy outside of like Mirrodin or something.

But then Visions is also super duper old, so I can't speak to general card power at that point. I think it predates Naturalize though.

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 26, 2017 7:29 am 
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I'm just trying to sort out the number of situations in which Mould beats out Rec Sage.

Sage:
Costs 2G - 3CMC, easy splash.
Has a 2/1 body.
Fetchable by Woodland Bellower
Can recur with Grapple with the Past.

Mould:
Can hit lands.
Can recur once via baby Jace.
Castable if opponent has active Brisela (but does nothing to her.)

I mean if you're specifically having problems with Rogue's Passage or Westvale Abbey, I guess...but otherwise I'm not seeing the point. It's not a bad card, but the number of situations where's its better in a practical sense than Sage are narrow, outside of the chance that you can maybe nail someone's access to a colour temporarily - which, yes, can win games - but how often do you try to do that, they have a spare land, and then you wish you had Mould later for an artefact or enchantment?

Well, now you have me wondering... if you cast Creeping Mold with Brain in a Jar, and destroy Westvale Abbey as it is being tapped to summon Ormendahl, Profane Prince, is the land destroyed before Ormendahl comes out to play?

It seems that Creeping Mold would have some advantages if you are playing with your jarred brains.

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 26, 2017 9:03 am 
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Wintervoid wrote:
I played Mold in a Mono Green Stampeding Wildebeests deck during Visions. At that time there were no Sages (Just the Monkey) and I think the other option for dealing w/ Enchantments was Naturalize? I played it for the versatility vs Naturalize (Or whatever instant we had at the time) for the decks that didn't have targets. I remember it being decent at the time, but if we had Sage, I don't think I would have touched Mold. Also, back then I remember less options to go into other colors, so removing a color could have a slightly higher impact then currently.

If 4CW became big, or something else that had a shakey mana base it could become a decent meta call, but with agro supreme, it is hard to justify the 4mc

Naturalize came way after Visions, maybe you are thinking of Emerald Charm?

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 26, 2017 12:54 pm 
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soupcannon wrote:
Well, now you have me wondering... if you cast Creeping Mold with Brain in a Jar, and destroy Westvale Abbey as it is being tapped to summon Ormendahl, Profane Prince, is the land destroyed before Ormendahl comes out to play?

It seems that Creeping Mold would have some advantages if you are playing with your jarred brains.


Yes, before Westvale Abbey becomes an indestructible creature.


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 26, 2017 1:55 pm 
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I think calling Creeping Mold hot garbage is a little extreme. In the right deck, it can be effective. I will agree that the vast majority of the time there are better things to run than a 4CMC sorcery that gives you a 1 for 1. I think any card that has been played in the World Championship at one point is certainly better than an obviously bad vanilla creature like Rotting Hulk: https://www.wizards.com/magic/expert/wc ... d_kuhn.asp

To Mythic Uncommon's point, I think some land destruction is healthy for the game, and Creeping Mold is a pretty good choice for that IMO. It's not aggressively costed like Stone Rain, so it won't be a big tempo swing for you. Also, I think it's healthy for there to be some kind of check for the nonbasic lands in Duels that could otherwise be difficult to deal with, like Westvale Abbey and Lumbering Falls.

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 26, 2017 2:08 pm 
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I think calling Creeping Mold hot garbage is a little extreme. In the right deck, it can be effective. I will agree that the vast majority of the time there are better things to run than a 4CMC sorcery that gives you a 1 for 1. I think any card that has been played in the World Championship at one point is certainly better than an obviously bad vanilla creature like Rotting Hulk: https://www.wizards.com/magic/expert/wc ... d_kuhn.asp

To Mythic Uncommon's point, I think some land destruction is healthy for the game, and Creeping Mold is a pretty good choice for that IMO. It's not aggressively costed like Stone Rain, so it won't be a big tempo swing for you. Also, I think it's healthy for there to be some kind of check for the nonbasic lands in Duels that could otherwise be difficult to deal with, like Westvale Abbey and Lumbering Falls.


If the right deck is a land destruction from 2000 with 8 1-mana dorks in it, 4x Stone Rain, 4x Plow Under, 4x Avalanche Riders, etc. and Creeping Mold is a 1-of that is a redundant land destruction card that could theoretically ping out a land, sure.

Let me know when we have a viable land destruction deck (i.e. one that starts attacking lands turn 2 and can do so for about the next 5-6 consecutive turns) and then maybe I'll consider Creeping Mold as a 1-of.

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 26, 2017 2:40 pm 
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Destroy target land needs to be printed ON a land for LD to be viable :P.


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 26, 2017 3:00 pm 
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Sure there isn't a good fit for it in Magic Duels like in that deck. That just happened to be the first deck I found in a search. There were other decks from that era that played it as well. My point was that while it isn't a good card and won't make the cut in most, if any, decks, it isn't at the same level as a bottom of the barrel card like Rotting Hulk. Given the right supporting cards, which we don't really have right now, Creeping Mold can actually be playable. There is no situation where something like Rotting Hulk or Minotaur Abomination is playable.
I've personally had some success with Creeping Mold in a Temur Land D deck. Was the deck tier 1? Absolutely not, but it did hold it's own against some good decks, and Creeping Mold was instrumental in winning several games by taking out a dual land, man land, or Dynavolt Tower.

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 26, 2017 3:49 pm 
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You people have no sense of humor.

Try playing my latest deck and see just how op Creeping Mold is!
viewtopic.php?f=61&t=17615&p=532664#p532664

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 26, 2017 4:17 pm 
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DJ0045 wrote:
Destroy target land needs to be printed ON a land for LD to be viable :P.


I would really love if we got a few copies of Ghost Quarter. Not for the purposes of making a dedicated LD deck (because it would be terrible for that).

Just because as the game progresses and we get more and more utility lands, having a method of answering them available to all colors would be pretty useful. Plus there is always the option of using it on yourself in a pinch for fixing or floating mana shenanigans >.>

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 26, 2017 4:22 pm 
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Psychatog wrote:
Naturalize came way after Visions, maybe you are thinking of Emerald Charm?


Very possibly. It was a long time ago. I just remember thinking how versatile Mold was at the time. I vaguely remember decks running some of the charms. I think the black one got some play mainboard?

But, tbh, the only LD decks that were any good had to have Strip Mine. (Before my time playing competitively) I remember people trying to run LD and not doing so hot w/ it. Even when Avalanche Riders came out, LD was more of a disruption strategy then a path to victory.

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 26, 2017 4:28 pm 
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Psychatog wrote:


Ah, the good ol' days of global and local enchantments...

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