No, KoD is asserting I'm scum because he knows how I interact with people. He knows I'm intentionally antagonizing him because I think he's scum. That's why he's been extremely defensive about his Ambar vote and is now lashing out against me. Note his reason is that I'm not offering insights, yet my earlier vote was on an Ambar wagoner. While my next vote was placed in jest to do the above mentioned antagonizing, it is currently on an Ambar wagoner and hasn't moved because of that reason.

Vote Count
Ambar (4): Lilan, MoD, Confused, Freddeh
MoD (2): Numbers, HW
Lilan (1): Ambar
HW (1): Rubik
Numbers (1): KoD

Not Voting: Scarlet, PP, Garren

with 12 alive it is 7 to lynch, deadline is Saturday, March 4th, 10:19 PST

when I post my next vote count (24 hours from now) I will be prodding everyone who hasn't posted since my last one. (24 hours ago.)

@Lilan: I'll pull up the two relevant posts.

Numbers


KoD


Those are the two posts.

Start with Number's first.

By the time of his post, five votes have accumulated on Ambar. His assessment: Ambar's wagon smells like a wagon on town, and it is likely scum is on that wagon. Look at the people on that wagon.

Now move to my wordy post which follows immediately close to his.

My post boils down to two things only. Number's assertion that Ambar's wagon is a wagon on town, and Number's lack of contributing more to the very people he seeks to cast suspicion on.


Now, when Ambar posted recently asking that we continue talking, all I did was revisit my own reasoning on Numbers. So no, Lilan, it isn't because Numbers, as you put, "defended" Ambar so much so as his roundabout way of "defending" Ambar by proclaiming that the wagon feels like a wagon on town and saying we should scumhunt on the people voting him yet not actually scumhunting himself.

Now, to make a connection.

JD


There's several things to note here. Some personal, others more general.

I'll start with the personal. Number's asserts that I know he is antagonizing him because I think he thinks I'm scum (this is going to get convoluted quick so I'll stop it right here). That couldn't be farther from the truth. If he's being antagonistic towards me, it is beyond me why he is aside from the most obvious reason in that he disagrees with me just as I disagree with him over many things. You need not look far into many of our posts to find such disagreements from me voiced towards him.

Now since he brought up my Ambar vote, let's talk about it. Here is the main thing everyone should look at when Numbers speaks about people voting Ambar. He isn't specific. He speaks very broadly in regards to the Ambar wagon and how the reasons are lack luster. Not worthy enough to warrant votes. It isn't until much later after much disagreement with me that it is I who he has focused on. As if it was a great trap set for scumhunting that he devised.

Finally, him not offering insights. I'm not sure what he is imagining, but remember my short conversation with Ambar about how giving any reason is not as good as giving no reason at all? I brought up an example, since we were all talking of Lilan at that point, that was mentioned by MoD I believe. Vote because blue eyes. Hardly helpful right? In my example, I mentioned vote because "reasons". After which, as Numbers says, he made a jest post voting MoD because "reasons". How that is supposed to be antagonizing to me idk since I never even addressed it. Truth be told there was no reason to address it since Numbers wasn't exactly involved in what was going on like most others.

So yeah, he hasn't offered insights. It is more like he is taking an opportunity to use the disagreement I have with him as his way of contributing even though he's offered nothing else on anyone else and is still focused on maintaining an argument with me rather than speaking about others. A perfect distraction/excuse from having to contribute more than is necessary if one were scum.

Oh hey, I wasn't imagining it. Numbers really did exclude someone from the Ambar wagon. Confused.

Of the five people consisting the L-2 wagon on Ambar I have not commented or voted only one of the five. Tell me again how I have a lack of insights going on.

Already explained in my post. I feel no need to further engage you in long winded conversations that detract from what I've said.

I would probably vote for PoPa, given that even if he is town, he seems unlikely to contribute much.

I must have missed that part where you addressed my vote for Lilan. Probably because you didn't mention it. I also missed the part where you discussed my comments on Confused. Probably, again, because you didn't mention it (I've noted your completely incorrect assertion that I excluded Confused from the wagon; how you got that from me simply saying I wasn't surprised by Confused's vote is beyond me) I definitely missed the part where you note the lack of anything I displayed on Fred, which would actually help your point. Unfortunately, again, it's because you didn't mention it. So you've manged to show that I haven't provided insights by conveniently not mentioning anything of my history outside of you and MoD. I see how you're making completely valid points and not simply lashing out against me like I said you were.

I'm not surprised you missed it. You tend to miss a lot apparently.

I didn't address your vote specifically for Lilan because, frankly, you bandwagoned onto Lilan after telling Ambar it worked for you. I doubt that needs to be explained to anyone who read over that.

I'm not surprised that you're confused about my comment in regards to Confused. Excluded is probably too heavy of a word to use. It's more like you singled Confused out. Why you're not surprised Confused jumped onto Ambar's wagon is beyond me, but you definitely differentiated between the rest of us and her with that comment.

And just for clarification, this is explained mostly for the benefit of others that might come along and ask similar questions to yours in case they do not understand where I am coming from (much like Lilan wanting to be sure about why I was voting you earlier). I leave it to them to judge what's been said as opposed to answering to you since you'll just draw it out.

Matter of fact, since I am leaving it to the rest of you to judge, what of all this?

Does Number's simple comment to Ambar on how Lilan was the third vote warrants voting Lilan work for him count as any kind of insight? Useful insight? How about Number's love of using such a big brush to paint sweeping generalizations about all of us who have voted Ambar without actually addressing us specifically (save me these later days)? Does that offer any particular insights to the rest of you on all of us voting Ambar aside from Number's assertion that all the reasons to be voting Ambar is wrong? How about his small comment about Confused? Insightful?

I'd love to hear your thoughts.

"I totally didn't do what you just said. Now let me explain to everybody else why I did exactly what you just said I did."
-KoD

Don't worry guys, we've got a whole year to think about this.

man whatever month is the next one, that 4th

March 4th isn't a saturday until 2017, so we've got two years.

Geez, that is a lot of time. Maybe just barely enough time to figure out the conversation between Numbers and KoD.

Numbers seemed pretty casual to be when he threw his vote onto Lilan based from ambar's 3rd-to-vote theory, like 'yea, ok, why not?'. He seems to be going with such a strong conviction that ambar is a town wagon right from the start that it makes me wonder why.

Can someone explain why he is not surprised to Confused voting ambar?

Can someone also explain to me the thing about him changing his vote to MoD? All I read was "Because, 'reasons' "

Did 5 pages really happen since my last post?!

Reading them(some of them again, I'm lazy these days).

So, if ambar want to claim and thinks he's gonna get lyched he should also claim who he is or under what username he posted on other forums, IMHO.

@freddeh,scarlet:read on KoD? you played with him more than me.

@MoD:you didn't react to me voting you at all,I didn't really write my motivations in a way that would have explained them to you if you didn't believe to have done something wrong, may I ask you what reasons you think I have for voting you?

@freddeh, if you switch your vote to lilan, I'll switch my vote to lilan, I'll still hold the right of removing it whenever I want, deal?



We are past the point where people start accusing you for posts you made without meaningful information because there is meaningful information in the thread, please start posting now.


Unvote;vote ambar: no reason to leave the wagon derail without forming a new one IMHO, he's not that townyish(see masterofdoom posts for why).
Still willing to switch to lilan if freddeh does, he didn't get better.
Also a vote for masterofdoom does literally nothing at the moment, and number never argued why to vote him after voting him.

You seem...confused.

Getting lynched for that one. So getting lynched.

To answer your first question, which frankly shouldn't have taken this long to be asked, I've said numerous times in numerous games that I can't read you for ****. So nothing you do will actually surprise me as I have no expectation of how you'll react to begin with. I do not expect players to know this, but I do expect town to ask what I mean. Mafia will not, because clarity isn't what mafia seek.

To answer your second question I'll present the actual course of events rather than KoD's misrepresentation of them:

The origin of this conversation is Ambar's voting for Lilan for being third without reason. Many players address the third on the wagon notion (none of which are KoD), including MoD who said using the reason of third was akin to using the reason of a player having blue eyes (which is a completely unfounded comparison as the third on the wagon notion was born out of statistics and it was only until it was a heavily known concept and mafia began intentionally avoiding that slot did the reason become invalidated in most circles). Ambar clarifies that his vote has fallen not strictly because Lilan was third but because it's third and indicative of a blatant bandwagoning due to the lack of reasons given for the vote. HW then asks Ambar what to do if you want to vote a person but there are already two votes on them. Ambar replies vote with a stated reason.

Now this is where KoD finally enters the fray. He jumps in to simply say having any reason isn't necessarily better than having no reason, a middle of the pack statement if there ever was one. He then drops his MoD reference and then follows it up by saying the entirety of his post is a moot point, completely invalidating any point he was trying to make. His post then serves no purpose save making MoD look like he's actually contributing something while continuing the down putting of Ambar. It's at this point that I mock KoD's post by voting the player he singled out for making a commentary that the player never actually made while using reasonless reasons as my justification.

@HW, you know I kinda expected it to be you.

So... that vote is out of spite?

Vote Count
Ambar (5): Lilan, MoD, Confused, Freddeh, HW
MoD (1): Numbers
Lilan (1): Ambar
HW (1): Rubik
Numbers (1): KoD

Not Voting: Scarlet, PP, Garren

with 12 alive it is 7 to lynch, deadline is Saturday, April 4th, 10:19 PST

No, I never vote out of spite. Whenever I post votes of an inciteful nature it's intended to guage response. KoD's choice to ignore it is far more telling than if he had responded to it, as has been shown later in the day, he likes to be goaded into responding. The fact that he's trying to portray MoD in a contributing light while intentionally avoiding commenting on somebody voting for him tells me that he didn't want to draw attention to the matter, hoping it would just drop out of sight. This is far more indicative that they are mafia brethren than town-ship. When you add to that MoD's jumping on the Ambar wagon as it began to stall with no new reasoning and his multiple callings for a cease to discussion and just lynching Ambar because Ambar said he's fine with being lynched and it's pretty obvious MoD is scum.