Mkay, so the people who are going to buy the party stuff with me still haven't arrived, I think I can elaborate my scumreads in the meanwhile. Unfortunately I'm not gonna do the best ISO and blabla cuz your forum is archaic and it gets even **** on mobile,buy anyway.

Rubik is being scumread for a few specific reasons. Him pushing himself desperately D1 to get the CS date still doesn't look good to me, neither does his "I felt like ExLight was town after his claim but I had no option other than lynch him". I also heavily dislike how he's the one that asked for a full amber claim because she had literally 0 chance of getting lynched, especially since we had already seen that she could use the (-1) vote on herself to make it harder to happen (did she even have a single vote at the time?), so I feel like that was an opportunistic way of using the fact she wasn't paying attention to the thread. I don't like him asking for a massclaim, since I feel like mafia can just make up roles on the spot and get away with it, while town would prolly out important stuff like inestigative and protective roles.
Him not scumhunting or wanting things solved easily reminds me of him in the two
games I played with him where he was scum (High Voltage Mafia and The Bulba vs. ZD crossover). Although this is meta and I might not have enough experience with him. You guys know him better, so
you should be able to tell whether this is a town!Rubik or sum!Rubik indicator.
Him voting SMS does give him some town points tho.



KoD and JD actually got my attention after I reread the thread. JD is most likely a survivor, alright, since we have real info from Zinger confirming this, but this this is a completely separate matter and proves nothing about the KoD/JD relationship. KoD's role wasn't confirmed by mechanical info from a verifiable source, and neither was his alignment. The usage of "Mason" is already completely off since at least one of them isn't town, and the fact he's a survivor doesn't exclude the possibility of KoD being scum. What annoys me the most is that JD's claim seems to point out some kind of Bodyguardish role, where we can't indirectly reach KoD. This reminds of SMS having a stallish protection that gave him more time, and makes me wonder if it's some kind of backlash for punishing town for taking too long to find out scum.

In fact, KoD's "information" is incredibly vague, and the fact we never heard of it again (the abstinence of reports like saying whether his role got blocked or failed also suggest it was a blatant lie) makes me believe it was actually a plan to bus SMS and get townpants, which seems to be working. I was massively scum reading him since D1, but when people told me he was "conftown" and had "an investigative role" I ruled him out, but after rereading the thread I noticed that these are most likely not the truth.

If anything, I feel like his role is anoter vote modifier, because JD seems completely sure about the hidden votes not being Zinger, which means either him or KoD prolly did it. If that's the case, it makes sense for him to desperately lynch HW so he couldn't clarify his role better about my alignment, making me an easy mislynch for the next day; or it could've even been an attempt to get me killed too in case HW really was linked to me. So KoD is back to my top scum list. I don't care if he also tunnels as Town, he's been trying to lynch town and is getting away with it, he's been a major force driving all the misslead wagons so far, weren't in SMS' final wagon despite "having info", and curiously both naga and amber who suspected him died. Today is still D3, so I wouldn't be surprised if he still had the vote modifiers and were able to actually put 2~3.5 votes on me like he did to HW.

JD, if you're really willing to play with town like me, please, this is a bastard game and Rag already said there are mod lies in it, use what you heard from KoD himself as evidence. Did he attempt to convice you to vote someone? Did mafia ever target him? Does the role he claimed have any discrepancies? Did he provide explanation for his votes or action? Are there gaps during his claimed night actions?


As for Tevish. As I said, I don't like his role. It screams scum, but negative utility is a common thing in bastard games, and it might be an alternate way of stopping Zinger so I'm fine with keeping him around until unless it's a game ender scenario. I don't like how he's quickly giving "solid" town and scum reads to people based mostly on meta, and I feel like that's something scum would do to keep things as manichean as possible. Him assuming stuff and not wanting to discuss properly also annoys me (i.e. the Zinger wincon, which, despite me explaining and even after my flip, Tevish still insisted that Zinger could win with Town - Zinger had to publicy announce that everyone else would lose for him to finally change his mind), but I don't know if that's how he plays. Anyway, I don't understand why his wagon shifted so hard into HW last phase and despite not wanting Tevish dead it kinda annoys me. Especially because the possibility of HW and me being linked was a thing and makes me wonder if that's because they wanted Tevish alive or HW dead.
Tevish, if you're town I'd like to ask you to be more careful with this kind of stuff, since a misdirected town leader can clear the wrong people, and be careful with this role please ok thanks.


Ok now that I'm done I'm gonna go buy booze and meat for the BBQ seeyall.
Please don't lynch me again, I just want to charge my mana in peace.

The important bits you missed were that KoD isn't a targeted alignment cop, he just gathers information. With SMS we were able to piece it into 1) applying to SMS and 2) it pointing to him being scum. KoD has since gathered more information and and we've discussed it at length in our QT but we don't feel it's pertinent to disclose the information because it's not damning to anybody and hasn't been indicative of saving anybody in the lynch. We've also not given out what information he's getting to avoid scum from being able to account for it when fake claiming. Couple that with our shared ability of being able to see who targets us in the night (this we have shown by pointing out Aaarrrgh has targeted KoD on multiple nights) and you have a position where scum has to weigh the risk/benefit analysis of a 1 for 1 trade. If we haven't been taken out yet it's most likely because they don't see the benefit out weighing the trade off.



You can't reach KoD? Interesting choice of words.



Judging people for not being around for the two hour window between SMS votes being removed on the first failed lynch (which KoD was a part of) and final deadline makes your argument seem much more town concern and not OMGUS.
Also since Funnier has claimed the Naga kill are you now asserting that KoD and Funnier are scum bros?
Also Also, there was an extra vote on SMS during the failed lynch. This, again, indicates a hidden voter that isn't Zinger. The fact that a hidden voter would be on now known scum indicates it's town as well, as scum have no reason to bus with a hidden vote since they won't get any town cred for it anyways.



He said there was "like one lie" which all things considered could very well be KoD's mod confirmation. Could also be anything/everything related to Zinger and your role just being a solid red herring. I haven't bothered questioning it because I can read KoD better than PMs the mod sends me. KoD and I discuss his reads which he subsequently votes on. He asks my opinions on people but since I'm 3p he's aware that my expectation in this game is to die and lose with little motivation to put one teams interests over the other. He hasn't changed his tune since the start of the game nor has anything he's provided proven false so far. I see no reason to question it on my part and our exchange has almost been more akin to our time in MU's hydra event.

Actually, HW never confirmed what your alignment would be. All he said was that you, for sure, have a new alignment. He didn't actually know what it was.


As for information related to my role, JD already did a rather on point summary that didn't reveal the particulars of my role. So I'm not surprised you're interested in just how I am generating information.

Here's what gets me though. Aside from what JD already addressed to you, which is gold in and of itself, you had asked earlier why is it I'm still alive. Here is something you had said towards Arrgh earlier.

[quote=ExLight]You'd be surprised of what people do to distance themselves, giving a small boost to someone who might be a cop doesn't mean much, we don't know if scum can block or redirect it anyway. If anything it's a pretty smart move even for scum since JD can see who targets KoD, which makes this generosity? act non-anonymous and puts townpants on someone..[/quote]

That quote came from a response to Arrgh wherein Arrgh mentioned he saw no scum motivation for Minish to voice me being the target of Arrgh's ability. The big take away from here, to help answer your previous question, is that JD will see who targets me. You know that already as it was show back when Arrgh had targeted three people.

So if you're wondering why I haven't been killed, well there you go. Perhaps they don't want to take a risk of being outed by JD once I'm targeted (and hey, that's probably why you're pleading with JD which just makes me more certain of voting you now). Your reaction is showing me that I've nailed you.

EBWOP:

I'm mod kill over replace in dead every time. Well, 99%

Also where the heck is everyone the day ends like tomorrow

Ex there is one person voting you.

Its literally just me and KoD voting

I;m kind of worried about Minish cause she hasn't posted once all day

Feel like couldve been silenced cause if she was ditching I'd think she wouldve said so in thread so I wouldve known to ditch too </3

If you can reply to this please help me vote Rubik so we can lynch scum and get the heck outta Dodge

Also I just noticed we have received no vote count today. If that was intentional it would be nice to know cause otherwise it'd be really nice to see whats going on with stupid vote modifiers and hidden voters today

I'm not silenced funnier. Lol. I just got a bit of mafia fatigue. Usually happens the longer games go on, and this one being hard to figure out isn't helping.

I think a mass claim wouldn't be too bad right now. The only other ability I have that I haven't said yet is the ability to edit posts. Only used it once the previous day to bold and color my vote because I forgot. But otherwise haven't used it because I don't see a use for it since it seems anti town to change anything drastic.

I know KoD made a case on me but I don't remember much of it now (will address more in depth later), but I do remember he was saying he was looking for interactions with SMS and apparently he thought mine and his were interesting. But tbh, I think scum interacts *less* with their scumbuds. Plus I spent the later half of day 1 making a case against SMS and was actively trying to lynch him over Ex. Seems kinda crazy that I was pushing him late day to be lynched if I knew he wouldn't actually die, because scum wants lynches. And then I lynched him for real when I could have not and just chalked it up to his claim being proven? Yeah, that's not really a great scum play.

Tbh, I dunno who the **** could be scum now since Naga and Amber turned out to be town. The Amber kill was really odd though. I'm getting a little paranoid that Freddeh might be scum since he's been so town read but hasn't been killed. But he's just so sensible.

Oh, I'd also like to say I'd be fine with a PK modkill.

Will give more thoughts later.

CS vote: KoD

(Funny thing about mentioning only editing once in this post and I had to edit this post cause I **** up the bolding).

If it's just Funnier and I, then I'm doubling down.

Vote: ExLight

Yea, of course you'd try to push my lynch when I'm not aroynd. Now place your hidden votes. They prolly activate when you and JD vote the same person, which you'll do in the last second. So that's basically 4.5 votes on me already.

Scum would still find a way to get rid of KoD because they usually have something to avoid investigative roles or to block roles. Yes, this game has weird roles, but I really doubt they'd nerf mafia to the point of making it impossible for them to take down a town investigative role. And scum would take down an investigative role even if that meant another scum dead because it's way more risky to leave someone who can bust the entire team alive.

If he really were town he would be sharing his info to us so we the entire town could discuss it instead of risking to die with it. The fact he's omitting it is proof that he's either making info up or that he's aware it will backfire by exposing the real scum.

What was this "one lie", JD?


Minish, please, why are you CS voting him? Are you aware that scum could've easily fake claimed an investigative role and bussed SMS to get town pants? KoD's role wasn't confirmed by Zinger like the others, he just shared what JD told him, which is basically what KoD told him.

CS Vote: Freddeh

JD has, time and again, already explained my role's information not being straight up alignment cop like you've seemed to convince yourself of. That being said, did you not just get done talking about how I wasn't on SMS's final lynch, yet you're sitting here saying I bused him to get town pants. Which is it?

More over, are you seeking Minish's approval or something to vote me? You're doing a lot of posturing about how scummy I am, yet you're not voting me. Why?

who istalking about alignment cops? stop shoving words in my mouth ffs

I must admit, I'm starting to tinfoil hat a KoD/JD/SMS scumteam. Pushing a first lynch d2 against SMS would have been a no-lose proposition, especially when SMS was under other heat. Of course they wouldn't push for a REAL lynch in the last couple of hours we had left, but if it happened they'd look to be (semi) confirmed. If it didn't, it would mean that SMS "Proved his ability" which is often treated as townpants even if there's no reason for the ability to be town.

My only counter is meta. When KoD and I were scum together, we were like Helium and Argon, we didn't react. KoD is pulling up, on the other hand, a major connection with JD. I think it's fairly undeniable that there is some sort of tie between them, even if we don't believe what it is. It's a very different strat from the one we used, but they might have been willing to play a gambit given how powerful the role SMS was dealt (dodging at least one full lynch)

I'm also in favor of a mass claim at this point. A bunch of us are already pretty heavily claimed (I'm full claimed) and this game is weird enough that I'm not sure we couldn't pick it apart.

JD already said that you not voting SMS could be explained by you just not being around at the time. What matters is that you came outta nowhere with ultra convenient "info that suggested SMS could be scum" and that's all you have to do to effectvelly bus him and get town pants, you don't have to be in the final wagon, just to be one of the main reasons for it to happen in the first place

and I'm not trying to ask for minish's consent on anything, I'm asking her why is she still townreading you blindly despite me just making a post poiting out your BS that she seems to have ignored since she didn't seem to discuss it in any way

I'm not voting you rn because I'd rather make sure everyone is on tha same page before we do that. Unfortunately town doesn't even seem to be trying, and that will prolly result in my mislynch again.

you're picking on me because you know I'm an easier lynch due to town being less sympathetic towards me due to me being a survivor and that's low af

As far as the final wagon on SMS goes, yes. There was, after all, a two hour window and those that had initially voted SMS were not present on the final wagon when it occurred (those that were were HW, Rubik, and Minish). But that's neither here nor there. Let me refer you back to your own words on this matter:





Refer to the underlined portions. Your whole issue with me is that I won't reveal the info my role has generated. So you're spring boarding from that into I must've bused SMS for town pants. This, despite the fact you earlier maintained my absence from SMS's final lynch as some kind of point against me despite having info against SMS. But never mind how much it looks like you're flailing on that.

Instead, two things:

1. JD was right to have persuaded me to focus on looking for interactions wrt to SMS to try and find scum as outing how my info obtained would only allow scum to try and come up with a convenient way to claim around said info.

2. Your entire focus on just what the info is, despite nothing pertaining to my role being leveled at you, speaks volumes in your reaction to this. Throwing back again to the fact that JD would be able to see if scum targeted me for a nk, that removes that option. The only other reasonable approach to, use your words, "reach" me would be to swing a lynch at me.


And going even further off of 1, and to address your idea that I'm just picking on you, my original option ***was*** Minish because of looking at the interactions around SMS (as I had posted about earlier wrt to Minish). However, the fact remains that HW confirmed that your alignment has changed and he did not know what to (despite your insistence that he said you were self). That just naturally makes you a better lynch option as opposed to someone I'd be swinging at based off of interactions (that I may be wrong about) with a dead mafia player.


@Tevish:

I linked earlier to a previous post JD had made, but essentially the connection between him and I can more or less be summed up as neighbors. I think Arrgh had asked previously about the flavor behind our connection to which I am JD's dog essentially.